In this episode, the hosts dive deep into the critical mistake many organizations make: treating surface-level process issues without addressing the underlying root causes. They introduce the concept of the "iceberg effect" in process management, where visible problems are merely symptoms of deeper systemic issues lurking beneath the surface. The discussion explores how rushing to fix what's immediately obvious often leads to wasted effort, temporary solutions, and recurring problems. Through compelling examples, they demonstrate how what appears to be a process breakdown is often actually a technology limitation, organizational culture issue, or capability gap. The hosts emphasize the importance of taking time to properly diagnose before prescribing solutions, even when stakeholders are pressuring for quick fixes. They share practical techniques for uncovering root causes, including asking "why" multiple times and examining patterns across different process failures. The conversation highlights how addressing symptoms creates busy work while solving root causes delivers exponential value. Listeners learn why investment in proper analysis upfront saves significant time and resources downstream. The episode provides a framework for distinguishing between symptoms and causes in process improvement work. This is essential listening for anyone tired of fighting the same process fires repeatedly.

5 Key Takeaways:

1. Look Below the Waterline: Like an iceberg, most process problems have visible symptoms above the surface, but the real issues—poor system integration, capability gaps, cultural resistance—lie hidden beneath and must be addressed for lasting solutions.
2. Resist the Quick Fix Pressure: When stakeholders demand immediate solutions, invest time in proper root cause analysis first; fixing symptoms creates recurring problems while solving root causes prevents future issues from emerging.
3. Ask "Why" Repeatedly: Use techniques like the "5 Whys" to drill down from surface symptoms to underlying causes—each answer should prompt another question until you reach the true source of the problem.
4. Pattern Recognition is Key: Look for similar issues occurring across different processes or departments; these patterns often reveal systemic root causes rather than isolated process failures.
5. Educate Stakeholders on True Costs: Help leadership understand that rushing to symptom-level fixes wastes more resources over time than investing upfront in root cause analysis—short-term speed often means long-term waste.

In this episode, the hosts tackle one of the most common pitfalls in business process management: when BPM teams become permanent process operators instead of enablers of change. They explore how organizations often fall into the trap of having their BPM experts do the work rather than embedding process excellence into operational teams. The discussion reveals why this creates dependency, prevents scaling, and ultimately undermines the strategic value of process management. Through real-world examples, they illustrate how BPM should function as a catalyst for organizational capability building rather than a permanent fix-it squad. The hosts emphasize that true process maturity means teaching teams to fish rather than fishing for them indefinitely. They examine the delicate balance between providing initial support and knowing when to step back. The conversation highlights how governance, clear boundaries, and outcome ownership are essential to breaking the cycle of dependency. Listeners learn why saying "no" strategically can be more valuable than always saying "yes." The episode provides practical guidance on transitioning from doer to enabler and building sustainable process capabilities. Ultimately, this is a call to action for BPM professionals to reclaim their strategic role and drive lasting organizational change.

5 Key Takeaways:

1. Break the Doer Dependency: BPM teams should enable and empower process owners rather than becoming permanent operators who do the work for them—otherwise you create unsustainable dependency and prevent true organizational capability building.

2. Define Clear Boundaries Early: Establish upfront what the BPM team will and won't do, including time-bound support arrangements, to avoid becoming the default solution for every process problem.

3. Focus on Capability Transfer: The goal is to build process management muscles within operational teams through training, coaching, and gradual handoffs—not to maintain control indefinitely.

4. Tie Support to Outcomes: When providing temporary assistance, link it to measurable outcomes and specific capability development milestones to ensure teams are progressing toward self-sufficiency.

5. Strategic "No" is Powerful: Learning to decline requests that would perpetuate dependency allows BPM teams to focus on higher-value strategic work and forces organizations to develop their own process competencies.

Summary

In this engaging episode, Caspar and Russell sit down with BJ Biernatowski and Zbigniew Misiak, co-authors of "Practical Business Process Modeling and Analysis," to discuss the evolving role of BPM in digital transformation. The guests share their journey of writing a book that took two years and was initially double its final size, revealing just how vast the BPM domain truly is. They tackle the uncomfortable truth that selling BPM is "one of the most unthankful jobs in the world," as organizations often see process modeling as isolated from actual business value. The conversation explores how BPM must shift from creating static BPMN diagrams to providing dynamic insights about organizational dependencies and connections. A major focus emerges around AI's transformative impact: AI needs BPM as "guardrails" to prevent hallucinations and ensure reliable outputs, while BPM needs AI to make process knowledge more accessible and actionable. The guests emphasize that successful BPM isn't about perfect models—it's about connecting processes to enterprise architecture, applications, roles, risks, and regulations in a unified repository. They discuss how AI agents will fundamentally change process work beyond simple sequential automation, requiring new approaches to modeling complex, non-linear workflows.

5 Key Takeaways

Value Over Visualization: Managers don't care about process models—they want results. BPM must focus on delivering measurable value (better communication, faster projects, fewer problems) rather than creating beautiful BPMN diagrams that only the modeler can read.

AI Needs BPM as Guardrails: AI systems require process repositories to provide reliable, context-aware information and prevent hallucinations. BPM gives AI the boundaries, regulations, goals, and organizational context needed to make trustworthy decisions aligned with business strategy.

The Repository Revolution: Modern BPM repositories must evolve beyond static process maps to become dynamic, real-time representations connecting processes, applications, roles, risks, regulations, and enterprise architecture—creating a unified knowledge graph accessible to both humans and AI.

Beyond Sequential Thinking: Traditional process modeling focused on linear sequences (A→B→C→D) suitable for automation, but AI agents enable non-linear, case management approaches requiring new modeling paradigms like object-centric process management to handle organizational complexity.

Convergence Is Coming: The artificial separation between BPM and Enterprise Architecture must end—both disciplines look at the same organization from different angles, and AI-powered tools can finally unite them into consolidated repositories that serve multiple use cases simultaneously.

Book Practical Business Process Modeling and Analysis

Amazon:
https://www.amazon.com/Practical-Business-Process-Modeling-Analysis/dp/1805126741

Packt:
https://www.packtpub.com/en-us/product/practical-business-process-modeling-and-analysis-9781805126386

Additional links:

BPM Skills cycle on BPMTips.com: https://bpmtips.com/category/bpm-skills/

"Is BPM the Scapegoat for AI Failures? A Critical Look at Process Management's Future"

In this candid episode, Caspar and Russell tackle the uncomfortable question: Is BPM destined to become the scapegoat for failing AI initiatives? They dive into Deloitte's Tech Trends 2026 report, which predicts that 40% of AI projects will be cancelled, and explore BPM's role in these failures. Russell questions whether there's a fundamental flaw in BPM methodology that prevents widespread adoption, while Caspar argues it's too early to blame a use case that's only 18 months old. The conversation takes an intriguing turn when they examine the tension between agile methodologies and process governance, with both hosts agreeing that organizations need structure at higher levels while allowing agility at granular levels. They discuss the challenge of integrating BPM into organizations already saturated with methodologies like Lean Six Sigma and Scrum. A key insight emerges: never appoint a perfectionist to lead your BPM project—generalists should be at the top with perfectionists handling the details. They also explore the complexity of defining process ownership, especially the critical role of end-to-end process owners, and debate whether BPM practitioners should adapt their standard role frameworks to fit existing organizational structures. The episode concludes with a promise to tackle the controversial topic of process taxonomy and SAP's influence on enterprise architecture in their next discussion.

1. The Scapegoat Risk: With 40% of AI initiatives predicted to fail by 2027, BPM risks becoming the fall guy despite the BPM-for-AI use case being only 18 months old—too early to judge its effectiveness.
2. Agility Needs Structure: Organizations should allow agile methodologies at granular levels (individual products or use cases) but maintain structured governance at higher levels to prevent chaos across 127+ development tribes.
3. Generalists Lead, Perfectionists Execute: Never appoint a perfectionist to lead BPM initiatives—put pragmatic generalists at the top and save perfectionists for detailed, lower-level work where precision matters.
4. Adapt to Existing Structures: Rather than imposing standard BPM roles on organizations already saturated with methodologies (Scrum, Lean Six Sigma), start with defining the end-to-end process owner and build around existing organizational capabilities.
5. Value Comes from Connections: The true value of BPM isn't in having models—it's in understanding the dependencies between enterprise artifacts (activities, roles, applications, risks) to prevent unintended consequences from changes.

Keywords

AI, business processes, innovation, change management, organizational structure, data quality, Stephen Wunker, BPM, technology adoption, consulting

Summary

In this episode of the BPM 360 Podcast, hosts Caspar and Russell engage with Stephen Wunker, managing director of New Markets Advisors, to discuss the transformative impact of AI on business processes and organizational structures. They explore the importance of adapting to change, the role of innovation in large enterprises, and the necessity of critical thinking in the age of AI. Stephen shares insights from his extensive experience in consulting and his latest book, 'AI and the Octopus Organization,' emphasizing the need for organizations to rethink their processes and embrace AI as a tool for achieving business objectives.

Takeaways

AI is a revolutionary tool that requires rethinking business objectives.

Organizations must adapt to change and embrace innovation.

The octopus serves as a metaphor for adaptability in business.

AI can enhance decision-making but requires human engagement.

Data quality is crucial for effective AI implementation.

Change management involves addressing emotional responses to disruption.

Startups and large enterprises face different challenges in innovation.

Experimentation is key to successful AI integration.

Organizations should prioritize a few key business questions for transformation.

Critical thinking is essential in the age of AI.

Sound bites

"AI is better than a human being."

"You cannot tango on your own."

"AI makes mediocre workers decent."

Chapters

00:00 Introduction and Personal Updates

02:24 The Impact of AI on Business

03:34 Stephen Wunker's Background and Expertise

06:33 Innovation Processes in Large Enterprises

10:13 The Role of Structure in Startups

11:56 AI as an Organizational Enabler

17:39 Rethinking Business Models with AI

21:10 The Importance of Data Quality

23:48 Emotional Aspects of Change Management

30:30 Strategies for AI Integration

33:32 Distributed Intelligence in Organizations

36:29 The Future of AI and Human Collaboration

42:54 Final Thoughts and Dilemmas

Keywords

BPM, process management, AI, trends, 2026, strategic asset, agentic AI, BPM singularity, digital twin, orchestration

Summary

In this episode of the BPM 360 Podcast, hosts Caspar and Russell discuss the revival of process management as a strategic asset, the role of agentic AI in BPM, and the convergence of BPM with other disciplines, leading to what they term 'BPM Singularity'. They explore the trends shaping BPM for 2026, emphasizing the importance of AI in enhancing process management and the need for organizations to adopt a holistic approach to process and data management.

Takeaways

The podcast is entering its fifth season, highlighting its growth and milestones.

There is an ambition to increase the frequency of podcast episodes this season.

The revival of process management is seen as a strategic asset for organizations.

AI is becoming a critical component in enhancing BPM capabilities.

The concept of agentic AI is crucial for the future of BPM.

BPM is gaining traction again due to the emergence of AI technologies.

Organizations need to manage process variance effectively to optimize operations.

The convergence of BPM with enterprise architecture and orchestration is essential for success.

AI is driving the need for a holistic understanding of organizational processes.

The podcast aims to explore the evolving landscape of BPM and AI throughout the season.

Sound bites

"AI is making these repositories accessible."

"The process scope is expanding."

"You cannot just think in your department."

Chapters

00:00 Welcome to Season 5

03:39 Trends in BPM for 2026

14:15 AI's Role in BPM

23:30 The BPM Singularity

33:26 Closing Thoughts and Future Episodes

Top 5 Takeaways from the Episode:

1. Workarounds Reveal the Real Process

Iris’s research shows that deviations from standard procedures—like nurses jotting notes on paper instead of using digital systems—aren’t mistakes, but signals. These workarounds often reflect system limitations, process flaws, or a drive to prioritize what truly matters: patient care.

2. What You See in Data Isn’t Always What Happened

Event logs often record what’s entered, not what’s executed. In domains like healthcare or construction, there’s a clear disconnect between reality and system registration. This gap challenges the reliability of process mining and reinforces the need for human context.

3. Process Design Should Embrace Imperfection

Traditional process methodologies often assume linearity and completeness. Iris proposes supplementing them with workaround analysis to reflect real-world complexity. Observing processes “in the wild” uncovers hidden inefficiencies, clever improvisations, and improvement opportunities.

4. Renovating a House = Living BPM

Iris’s LinkedIn series drew clever parallels between home renovation and process management. From shifting plans and stakeholder coordination to “workarounds” by plumbers, she illustrates how BPM principles apply even in everyday life—complete with unpredictable dependencies and process entropy.

5. People, Teams & the Human Side of Mining

In her latest paper, Iris explores how process mining can reveal team dynamics and human behavior—like preferences, inefficiencies, or even social loafing. But she also highlights the ethical balance: to mine responsibly, researchers must anonymize data while still drawing actionable insights about team structure and collaboration.

We hope you enjoy our BPM Podcast.
Subscribe and stay tuned for more.
Please send us your comments and questions to
questions@bpm360podcast.com

Top 5 Takeaways from the Episode:

1. CI Is a People Game, Not Just a Process Game

Gary Cox’s book, Cultivating Champions of CI, emphasizes that sustainable continuous improvement (CI) isn’t about tools or theory—it’s about developing people, mindsets, and a culture that values thoughtful problem-solving over quick fixes.

2. The Four P’s of Meaningful Change

Beyond People, Process, and Purpose, Gary introduces a fourth essential “P”: Problem-solving. When processes break, people instinctively create workarounds. Organizations need to nurture transparency and curiosity to tackle root causes instead of patching symptoms.

3. Standardize to Improve, But Don’t Worship the Standard

Standardization creates a necessary baseline—but it’s only a snapshot in time. Businesses must continuously adjust that baseline to reflect evolving goals, technologies, and customer expectations. “Standard until better” is the motto.

4. Culture Beats Tools—Every Time

While Six Sigma tools and AI can accelerate analysis, real transformation only happens when leaders connect individual growth to business needs. Empowering people with purpose turns process improvement into a shared journey, not just a checklist.

5. Cartoons, Curiosity, and Career Growth

Gary’s creative side (his “Cox Box” cartoons) and his unconventional journey from letter carrier to national CI director show that playfulness and openness to opportunity can be powerful leadership tools—especially when helping others grow.

We hope you enjoy our BPM Podcast.
Subscribe and stay tuned for more.
Please send us your comments and questions to
questions@bpm360podcast.com