In this first installment of a two-part conversation, Bill Loucks joins Behind The Thin Blue Line to break down the evolving drug crisis impacting communities across America. A nationally respected subject matter expert in narcotics, transnational criminal organizations, and trafficking investigations, Loucks examines how synthetic opioids, cartel business models, and global trafficking routes have reshaped the threat landscape. The discussion moves from the southwest border to rural backroads, highlighting how modern cartels operate like multinational corporations while adapting to enforcement pressure.

This episode explores how synthetic drugs have changed the risk environment for law enforcement, first responders, and families, and why today’s drug crisis presents challenges unlike anything seen in previous decades.

Episode Highlights

• [02:16] Introduction to Bill Loucks and his background in narcotics and transnational investigations
• [04:36] Why overdose numbers are shifting and how enforcement pressure is redirecting cartel operations
• [07:55] The unseen hazards of synthetic drugs for law enforcement and first responders
• [11:42] How modern cartels operate as sophisticated business enterprises
• [15:59] The cartel research and development model behind heroin and fentanyl expansion
• [19:00] Why rural communities are increasingly targeted by trafficking networks
• [24:27] Venezuela, Colombia, and the geopolitical influence on narcotics trafficking
• [27:47] China’s role in precursor chemicals and the fentanyl pipeline
• [30:59] Why synthetic drugs are more profitable and easier to produce than traditional narcotics
• [36:38] What happens when supply is disrupted and how withdrawal may drive future crime trends
• [42:48] Corruption, cartel violence, and why the United States faces a different threat profile
• [43:59] Smoke shops, synthetic cannabinoids, and the legal gray areas creating enforcement challenges
• [57:17] Why marijuana cases are often strategy-driven and financially motivated
• [59:23] Targeting proceeds through civil seizure and controlled substance tax enforcement

Links & Resources

CDC Drug Overdose Dashboard
https://www.cdc.gov/drugoverdose/

DEA One Pill Can Kill Campaign
https://www.dea.gov/onepill

North Carolina Justice Academy
https://ncja.ncdoj.gov/

Listener Advisory
This episode contains discussions related to drug trafficking, overdose deaths, addiction, cartel violence, and law enforcement operations. Some content may be emotionally intense. Listener discretion is advised.

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Stay tuned for Part 2 of this discussion with Bill Loucks.

Billy Queen returns in part 2 of this two-part series, to share what it cost to live undercover when the danger didn’t come in short bursts, but followed him every hour of every day. As a longtime ATF agent embedded deep inside the Mongols, Billy describes moments where a single wrong move could’ve ended his life. This conversation matters because it exposes the personal toll of long-term undercover work, especially the lines that get blurred between duty, identity, and survival.

Episode Highlights

• [00:00] Billy picks up the story with a weapons “qualification” that turns into a test of trust and fear
• [04:50] The physical and psychological abuse of prospecting inside the Mongols
• [08:30] A fellow prospect tries to leave and is forced into a deadly gamble
• [11:55] Living with the constant threat of being exposed and killed
• [14:41] Orders to commit violence and where Billy draws his personal line
• [22:01] Losing contact with family while maintaining his undercover role
• [24:44] Grief, loyalty, and the emotional pull of brotherhood
• [28:20] Parallels between combat, law enforcement, and outlaw gangs
• [31:14] A moment that forces Billy back to his true identity
• [34:33] Witness protection and being separated from his children
• [37:29] The limits of traditional mental health support for undercover agents
• [42:56] Moments that nearly broke him and how he coped in isolation
• [45:14] Realizing the consequences of a life spent undercover
• [52:08] Lessons learned and why this kind of operation shouldn’t happen again
• [53:08] Billy reflects on who he is today and what still drives him

Links & Resources

• Under and Alone by Billy Queen: https://a.co/d/06QaUd4r
• North Carolina Gang Investigators Association: https://www.ncgia.org/
• UNC Greensboro Digital Media Center: https://uncg.libguides.com/dmc
• North Carolina Center for Safer Communities: https://www.dpi.nc.gov/districts-schools/district-operations/center-safer-schools
• Follow Behind the Thin Blue Line for more stories like this one!

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Have a question or topic you’d like explored on the show? Know someone whose story belongs Behind the Thin Blue Line?

Share this episode with someone interested in real-world law enforcement stories

Contact us: mbridgeman@behindthethinblueline.org

Listener Advisory

This episode includes discussions of real-world violence, criminal activity, and emotionally intense subject matter. Listener discretion is advised.

For the first episode of Behind the Thin Blue Line, I’m joined by retired ATF Special Agent Billy Queen. Billy spent years working deep undercover inside outlaw motorcycle gangs, earning trust through presence, restraint, and reputation. In Part 1 of this two-part conversation, he begins unpacking how those early steps unfolded, what it took to establish credibility from the inside, and why some undercover assignments leave no room for hesitation or second guesses.

Episode Highlights

• [00:01:40] Billy’s journey from Vietnam veteran to federal agent
• [00:05:00] Why long-term undercover work inside motorcycle gangs operates differently
• [00:08:00] Why the Mongols gang became a priority for federal investigators
• [00:10:45] Early steps toward embedding inside the organization
• [00:15:10] How trust forms without forced conversations
• [00:18:45] The transition from hang-around to prospect
• [00:23:00] Managing a second identity under constant scrutiny
• [00:36:00] A confrontation that reshaped Billy’s standing inside the club
• [00:40:30] The physical and psychological toll of constant prospecting
• [00:44:15] How violence was normalized inside daily club life
• [00:48:00] The pressure to prove loyalty without asking questions
• [00:52:30] What Billy knew was coming as the operation deepened

Links & Resources

• Under and Alone by Billy Queen: https://a.co/d/06QaUd4r
• North Carolina Gang Investigators Association: https://www.ncgia.org/
• UNC Greensboro Digital Media Center: https://uncg.libguides.com/dmc
• North Carolina Center for Safer Communities: https://www.dpi.nc.gov/districts-schools/district-operations/center-safer-schools
• Follow Behind the Thin Blue Line for Part 2 of this conversation

Join the Conversation

Have a question or topic you’d like explored on the show? Know someone whose story belongs Behind the Thin Blue Line?

Share this episode with someone interested in real-world law enforcement stories

Contact us: mbridgeman@behindthethinblueline.org

Listener Advisory

This episode includes discussions of real-world violence, criminal activity, and emotionally intense subject matter. Listener discretion is advised.