Can we talk? I feel like we can’t, actually. At least not at work. We can make word noises out of our faces but most of it is overly polite, passive aggressive, aggressive/aggressive, or corporate gobbledegook.

It’s ridiculous, really. Yet another way our workplaces are distinctly not human.

That’s why I brought Michael Lee onto this week’s DesuckifyWork® podcast. He’s all about making work more pro-human. By helping people have useful conversations, especially ones where we embrace conflict.

Conflict helps us learn, solve problems, make ideas better.

But we spend so much energy avoiding it because our caveman brains fear we’ll get thrown to the Woolly Mammoths if we don’t keep the peace.

Also, most of us suck at conflict. Michael has spent years researching how we can get better at it. And he shares a bunch of those ideas during this episode. My favorite? Arguing for someone else’s POV, especially one we don’t agree with.

That practice alone would probably take about 80% of the suck out of workplace communication. It might have an even great effect on weighty conversations outside of work like politics, religion or your favorite Beyonce song.

My favorite is the one that’s playing out of earshot. But I’d be happy to argue in favor of whatever you like.

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Welcome to the DesuckifyWork® podcast. The show where we cut through the BS and find ways to make work more fun, more human and less ridiculous. All of which makes your business more profitable, by the way. This episode is part of our ongoing Prohuman Series, in partnership with the Prohuman Foundation.

(If you enjoy this one, please like, share, rate, review or subscribe to the podcast.)

Let the desuckifying begin.

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You can follow Michael on LinkedIn. And check out The Civility Initiative at The University of Charleston to learn more about his work and his podcast “When We Disagree.”

If you enjoyed the conversation and would like to find some calm in the chaos of work, I invite you to schedule a free half-hour discovery session. Type “meow” in the calendar invite and I’ll also send you a free DesuckifyWork® t-shirt!

Bye, everyone!

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Bonus questions from Michael:Why do you like spending time listening to this podcast?

Work sucks less when trust is more than just a word on a company website.

Trust is at an all time low—from corporations to government to media—our faith in our foundational institutions is flimsier than ever. Add AI to the mix and it’s a wonder we believe anything, ever.

We expect people to just show up at work and functional normally in the face of all this? It’s crazy. And if you look around and most workplaces today, “normal” is clearly not happening.

Courage is the way out, according to this week’s guest on the DesuckifyWork® podcast. Maryam Mehrtash is a marketing exec and author who has demonstrated courage since she was barely able to speak, as a refugee from Iran, along with her family.

Today, she writes about courage every week on her Substack—This is Not a Memo. She views courage as a skill. Something we can build over time with “reps.” Start small with something as simple as saying what you actually want for dinner instead of “whatever is fine.” Tell your friend, “I’d love a second glass of wine” instead of politely declining.

Before you know it, you’ll be the weirdo at work who never flinches when the hard thing needs to be said. You may even inspire other weirdos to join you.

That’s how we build trust at work, by saying and doing hard things. By living out the values we too casually post on corporate websites. By being reliable even in the face of external madness. Especially then.

So, who’s ready to get weird?

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Welcome to the DesuckifyWork® podcast. The show where we cut through the BS and find ways to make work more fun, more human and less ridiculous. All of which makes your business more profitable, by the way. This episode is part of our ongoing Prohuman Series, in partnership with the Prohuman Foundation.

(If you enjoy this one, please like, share, rate, review or subscribe to the podcast.)

Let the desuckifying begin.

—

You can follow Maryam on LinkedIn and Instagram. And be sure to subscribe to her Substack—“This is Not a Memo,” where she shares stories of courage every week.

If you enjoyed the conversation and would like to find some calm in the chaos of work, I invite you to schedule a free half-hour discovery session. Type “meow” in the calendar invite and I’ll also send you a free DesuckifyWork® t-shirt!

Bye, everyone!

—

Bonus questions from Maryam:If you stripped away your work title, what is the one thing that feels incredibly easy to you but looks like magic to everyone else?

Work sucks less when talking about mental health becomes as boring as talking about going to the dentist.

When it’s just another thing. Like that show everyone’s watching. The game last night. Or that new laundry detergent that really does make your whites 20 percent whiter.

When it’s fully normalized and casualized.

That’s what Paul MacFarlane wants. A return guest on the DesuckifyWork® Podcast, Paul is a creative soul who believes our work should bring out the best in humanity.

And our humanity is crying out for some help right now. AI, layoffs, wars, polarization. It’s the soup we swim in every day. Why the hell can’t we talk about how we’re coping with all of it without making it weird?

We all have emotions. And we’re all bringing ‘em to work despite 100 plus years of effort to keep them out.

Let’s talk about them. Let’s help each other deal with them. Let’s realize that our capacity to feel things is the greatest gift in the universe and is the thing that will guide us through every possible uncertainly that comes our way.

Let’s be boringly, beautifully, unabashedly, human.

Welcome to the DesuckifyWork® podcast. The show where we cut through the BS and find ways to make work more fun, more human and less ridiculous. All of which makes your business more profitable, by the way.

(If you enjoy this one, please like, share, rate, review or subscribe to the podcast.)

Let the desuckifying begin

You can follow Paul on LinkedIn. And check out his site at thepaulmacfarlane.com to learn more about his work and his delightfully human take on the world.

If you enjoyed the conversation and would like to find some calm in the chaos of work, I invite you to schedule a free half-hour discovery session. Type “meow” in the calendar invite and I’ll also send you a free DesuckifyWork® t-shirt!

Bye, everyone!

Bonus questions from Paul:Do you think the normalization and casualization of mental health would be a good thing? If so, how could you help make it happen?

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