Transhumanist author and political candidate Zoltan Istvan argues that AI and humanoid robots won’t just change the economy, they’ll replace most human work faster than governments can respond, and without a safety floor, society risks chaos. His solution is straightforward: Universal Basic Income as the minimum stability layer before the job apocalypse hits.

Zoltan Istvan is a futurist, writer, and longtime voice in the transhumanist movement. He’s the author of The Transhumanist Wager, a former National Geographic journalist who traveled through conflict zones, and a public figure known for running political campaigns built around radical tech-driven ideas — from longevity and human enhancement to automation policy. In this episode, he explains why he’s now running for Governor of California (2026) and why AI has pushed him away from old “pre-AI” economic thinking.

In this conversation, you’ll hear what it’s like to think like a Futurist: Choosing UBI because it’s the only way to prevent mass instability when millions of people get priced out of the labor market.

He explains, among other things:

◼️ Why he believes robots will be smarter, stronger, cheaper — and why companies will choose them (they don’t get sick, don’t sue, and don’t stop working)
◼️ Why Universal Basic Income isn’t a left vs right idea — and why even people like Milton Friedman supported versions of it
◼️ Why governments will likely implement UBI too late — after layoffs, unrest, and “pitchfork moments” have already started
◼️ What he calls an “automated abundance economy”: UBI + household robots + a new definition of the “American Dream”
◼️ The most visceral sign that this is already happening: his story of walking through San Francisco and seeing driverless cars everywhere
◼️ Why “retraining” won’t save most workers if AI improves every few months
◼️ The uncomfortable geopolitics: why the US, China, and Europe are effectively in an AI arms race — and why collaboration only happens after catastrophe
◼️ His fears about superintelligence — and why racing toward it could be even more dangerous than traditional war
◼️ His long-term transhumanist vision: merging with AI, brain–computer interfaces, and a “Star Trek” future — but only if society survives the transition
◼️ How his views have evolved since writing The Transhumanist Wager in a pre-AI era, and why he’d write a very different book today

Chapters

00:00 UBI for the AI Age
03:55 Will We Act Too Late?
05:05 Why Zoltan is Running as a Democrat
08:44 How Fast Jobs Disappear
11:23 Robot for Every Home
15:35 AI Safety & the USA vs China Race
19:41 What Trump Might Do on AI
26:00 Star Trek Future & Meaning
30:53 How Zoltan Became a Transhumanist
35:28 Writing The Transhumanist Wager
39:40 Quantum Archaeology
50:35 Why Primitivism Feels Attractive
56:41 Final Message: Prepare Now

Explore Zoltan Istvan’s work
◼️ Website: https://www.zoltanistvan.com
◼️ Campaign (California 2026): https://zoltanistvan2026.com
◼️ More interviews & talks: search “Zoltan Istvan” on YouTube / podcasts

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◼️ All my work, newsletter & socials: https://robinduijvelshoff.com

Political economist Nick Srnicek breaks down how AI is reshaping capitalism, work, and global power — and why the real story isn’t “robots taking all our jobs”, but who owns the systems and how states choose to deploy them.

Nick Srnicek is a Canadian writer and academic, and a lecturer in Digital Economy at King’s College London. He’s best known for his books Platform Capitalism, Inventing the Future: Postcapitalism and a World Without Work (with Alex Williams), and After Work: The Fight for Free Time (with Helen Hester). He’s also closely associated with debates around accelerationism, post-work politics and the digital economy.

In this episode you get an insider’s view of how AI, platforms and states interact — from Washington and Beijing’s different strategies to Europe’s struggle for “digital sovereignty”, and what all of this really means for ordinary workers over the next decade.

He explains, among other things:
◼️ Why today’s AI boom sits on top of decades of digital capitalism — and how platforms like Google, Amazon and Nvidia turn data, chips and models into monopoly power
◼️ The crucial difference between the US and China’s AI strategies: chasing “the best model” vs. deeply integrating AI into industry, logistics and state capacity
◼️ How beliefs about fast vs slow AGI “takeoff” are quietly shaping export controls, chip policy and national security decisions in Washington
◼️ Why Europe risks becoming a mere “rule-taker” between US and Chinese AI stacks — and what it would take to become a genuine third pole
◼️ What a realistic future of work under AI might look like: not total job loss, but more surveillance, precarity, and intensified exploitation unless politics changes

Explore Nick Srnicek’s work
◼️ Platform Capitalism – how digital platforms extract rent and dominate markets
◼️ Inventing the Future: Postcapitalism and a World Without Work (with Alex Williams) – a manifesto for a post-work, high-tech left
◼️ After Work: The Fight for Free Time (with Helen Hester) – why real freedom means transforming work and care, not just adding gadgets

(Search “Nick Srnicek Platform Capitalism” or “Nick Srnicek After Work” on your favourite bookstore or platform.)

https://x.com/nsrnicek

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◼️ All my work, newsletter & socials: https://robinduijvelshoff.com

Kevin Kelly – co-founder of WIRED and one of the world’s most influential technology thinkers – explains why you shouldn’t try to be “the best”, but “the only”, why your most “wasted” year might become the engine of your future, and why we’re still at day one of AI.

Kevin is the founding executive editor of WIRED magazine and now its “Senior Maverick”. For decades he’s been known as a “cool hunter” of the future – predicting trends in technology, culture and work long before they go mainstream. He’s the author of books like What Technology Wants, The Inevitable, Excellent Advice for Living and his new photography book The Colors of Asia, based on 50 years of traveling and shooting across the continent.

In this episode, you’ll hear what it’s like to build a life as a project-driven creator rather than a career employee, to help invent internet culture at WIRED, and to spend half a century documenting a disappearing Asia – all while thinking deeply about the future of AI, work and meaning.

He explains, among other things:

◼️ Why “follow your bliss” is terrible advice for most young people – and why mastering anything first is the real unlock if you don’t know what to do with your life
◼️ How to design a life where you’re the only one who does what you do, instead of competing to be “the best” in a crowded field
◼️ Why time off, “goofing off” and even taking 6–12 months to do something that looks like failure might become the most important period of your life
◼️ How to think in projects and seasons instead of a linear career – the “Hollywood model”, 5-year projects, and moving between the “cave and the commons”
◼️ His honest reflections on WIRED: what they got right, what he regrets, and why he thinks they could have invented Google-style ad auctions
◼️ Why he believes we’re still at day one of AI, what surprised him about large language models, and why intelligence is not a ladder but a “high-dimensional space”
◼️ Why he thinks truly practical AI needs bodies (robots), what’s missing from today’s language-only systems, and how self-driving and embodied AI may really unfold over decades
◼️ The four books that shaped his worldview – from the Bible and Walden to Finite and Infinite Games – and how the idea of “infinite games” changed how he designs his own life
◼️ The deeper message behind The Colors of Asia: how paying close attention to “ignored” things can become a source of joy, creativity and even a career

Explore Kevin Kelly’s work
◼️ Books (selection): What Technology Wants, Out of Control, The Inevitable, Excellent Advice for Living, The Colors of Asia
◼️ More of Kevin’s essays, talks and projects: search for “Kevin Kelly” and “The Technium” or “The Colors of Asia”

The Colors of Asia: https://kevin2kelly.myshopify.com/products/colors-of-asia-a-visual-journey

Connect with Robin / more episodes
◼️ All my work, newsletter & socials: https://robinduijvelshoff.com