In Episode 10 of Fool Me Twice, Steve Van Aperen and Bradford Oakes dive headfirst into the murky worlds of art fraud, AI deception, political deflection, and undercover policing—unpacking how lies work, why they succeed, and what ultimately exposes them.

The episode opens with a light-hearted exchange about names, identity, and misdirection, setting the tone for a deeper conversation about how perception shapes belief. From there, the hosts revisit the concept of amygdala hijacking, the neurological fight-or-flight response, that can override rational thought. Steve explains how emotional overload, often seen in road rage or explosive confrontations, can cloud judgment. Importantly, he reveals why provoking anger during an interrogation is counterproductive.

The conversation pivots to artificial intelligence and so-called AI “hallucinations.” As machines begin producing confident but inaccurate information, the hosts explore a chilling possibility: what happens when technology learns not just to be wrong, but to deceive?

Political theatre also comes under scrutiny, particularly when public figures, specifically Pam Bondi, respond to accusations with outrage rather than answers. Steve breaks down this classic deflection tactic: attack the interviewer, shift the pressure, avoid the substance. It’s a familiar behavioural pattern in deceptive personalities.

The heart of the episode focuses on art fraud and memorabilia scams, where massive sums of money change hands based on signatures, provenance, and trust. From forged masterpieces to fake sports collectibles, the hosts examine how greed, ego, and opportunity drive deception. Steve contrasts high-risk crimes like drug trafficking with lower-visibility fraud schemes that can net millions with less immediate scrutiny. He shares gripping stories from his undercover policing days, including controlled buys and elaborate sting operations involving the bedsheets, illustrating how criminals often get caught not because they’re reckless, but because they’re habitual.

Brad adds perspective from the entertainment world, where joke theft and inferred deception mirror larger fraud dynamics. Whether it’s forged paintings, counterfeit signatures, or prison artwork attributed to notorious criminals, the formula remains the same: notoriety plus narrative equals perceived value.

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Episode 9 of Fool Me Twice dives deep into the many shades of deceit in sport, with Brad Oakes and Steve Van Aperen exploring how dishonesty can range from subtle strategy to outright corruption.

The episode opens with a broader discussion about lying, including how deception is often embedded in everyday life and even professional roles. From there, the conversation shifts into the sporting arena, where the stakes are high and the incentives to bend the rules can be enormous. Brad and Steve identify two main streams of deceit in sport. The first is tactical deception, the kind that is considered part of the game. Teams disguise strategies, bluff opponents and conceal intent. This form of deceit is often accepted as legitimate competition.

The second stream is more troubling. It involves cheating, performance enhancing drugs, match fixing and financial corruption. Steve recounts his experience being approached by the International Cricket Council to conduct integrity testing aimed at stamping out corruption in cricket. He explains the difference between match fixing and spot fixing, and reflects on the challenges of investigating sporting dishonesty without whistleblowers or hard evidence.

The discussion broadens to high profile scandals, including Lance Armstrong and the infamous 1919 Black Sox baseball scandal. Both examples highlight how deception can be sustained for years when money, reputation and power are at stake. The hosts explore how group complicity makes corruption complex but also fragile, as it often takes only one insider to expose the truth.

They also touch on doping in racing and other sports, noting the constant tension between reactive investigations and proactive prevention. Steve draws on his law enforcement background to explain that most crimes are only investigated once they are reported, and without evidence or insiders coming forward, many suspicious outcomes remain just that, suspicions.

Episode 9 ultimately examines how money, ego, status and opportunity intersect in sport. It reinforces the podcast’s central theme: deceit is rarely simple, often rationalised, and almost always driven by motive.

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In episode 8 of the Fool Me Twice Podcast, comedian Brad Oakes is joined by former police detective Steve Van Aperen for an in depth discussion on lying deception memory and investigative interviewing. The episode examines how professionals distinguish between deliberate dishonesty and genuine human error and why this distinction matters.

Steve Van Aperen defines a lie as the intentional act of misleading someone while knowing the information is false. He contrasts this with common memory failures where people unknowingly provide incorrect information. The discussion opens with a light hearted clarification after a previous episode caused confusion when Steve accidentally implied he had been married. He explains this was a misstatement rather than a lie and uses it as a practical example of how easily memory and language can mislead without malice.

A central theme of episode 8 is the unreliability of eyewitness testimony. Steve recounts a robbery investigation where several witnesses described completely different getaway vehicles despite observing the same incident only minutes earlier. The inconsistencies were later traced to the witnesses speaking with each other and unintentionally influencing their recollections. CCTV footage ultimately confirmed the true vehicle demonstrating why corroboration is essential.

Brad Oakes questions how investigators decide which witness is most accurate. Steve explains that confidence detail and certainty do not equal truth and that every account must be supported by independent evidence. He highlights how mistaken identification has contributed to wrongful convictions including cases involving the death penalty.

The episode then shifts to police interviewing techniques. Steve explains that closed yes or no questions give deceptive people an advantage by limiting what they must say. Open questions such as asking someone to explain events from beginning to end require the speaker to construct a narrative. Truthful people tend to recall events using sensory and emotional detail while liars struggle due to increased cognitive effort which often reveals itself through hesitation filler language and inconsistencies.

Steve also introduces behavioural benchmarking where investigators observe how a person responds to neutral questions and compare that behaviour to responses during sensitive topics. While changes may indicate deception he stresses the importance of accounting for stress fear and normal memory lapses.

The episode concludes with examples of people lying for self protection rather than criminal guilt and a discussion of carefully worded denials using a famous athlete case. Episode 8 reinforces that while lying is universal exposing deception is not always useful particularly outside formal investigations.

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Learn more about Fool Me Twice by visiting www.foolmetwice.com.au

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