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Leadership 2.0

Leadership 2.0

Written by: Dirk Verburg
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About this listen

Welcome to the 'Leadership 2.0' podcast!


I believe that leadership is very important for two reasons. First of all, the decisions leaders take, and their capabilities to implement these decisions, are the most important differentiators between the success and failure of the organizations they work for. Secondly, leaders make a huge difference in the well-being of the people in their organizations, and, finally, for the well-being of our society as a whole. This podcast presents interviews with thought leaders and practitioners in the area of leadership, to inspire you to become the best leader you can be! What my guests say about this Podcast: 'You ask very good questions', 'You really do your research', 'You go beyond the surface'. So, if you want to listen to dialogues about leadership that go beyond the surface, this podcast is probably for you! Happy listening, and, please let me know what you think!

© 2025 Leadership 2.0
Careers Economics Management Management & Leadership Personal Success Politics & Government
Episodes
  • 36. 'The Dark Side of Leadership' - Manfred Kets de Vries
    Jan 12 2026

    Unfortunately, nowadays one look at a television news bulletin or a glance at a newspaper cover is enough to see the dark side of leadership. However, many people do not need to switch on the TV or read the paper to witness this; instead, they experience the dark side of leadership every day within their own organizations. They happen to work for "Psychopath Lights"—or, as Manfred Kets de Vries likes to call them 'Seductive Operational Bullies' (SOBs).

    In the 36th episode of the Leadership 2.0 podcast, I interview Manfred Kets de Vries, who has published extensively on this topic. During our conversation, Manfred and I discussed the following:

    • 00:00 Why do people want to lead others?
    • 02:32 Why do people want to be led?
    • 11:05 The Dark Dyad and Psychopaths Lights (SOBs)
    • 16:51 Why are SOBs attracted to the Financial Sector?
    • 21:30 Can SOBs Be coached?
    • 26:38 The Impact of Life Changing Circumstances On SOBs
    • 35:21 Strategies for SOB victims
    • 40:45 Why Leaders Should Understand Their Shadow Side


    ► About Manfred Kets de Vries

    Manfred F. R. Kets de Vries is the Distinguished Clinical Professor of Leadership Development and Organisational Change and the Raoul de Vitry d'Avaucourt Chaired Professor of Leadership Development, Emeritus, at INSEAD.

    His specific areas of interest are leadership, career dynamics, executive stress, entrepreneurship, family business, succession planning, cross-cultural management, team building, coaching, and the dynamics of corporate transformation and change. Manfred F. R. Kets de Vries directs The Challenge of Leadership Executive Education programme.

    He is the founder of the INSEAD Global Leadership Centre, the programme director of INSEAD's top management seminar The Challenge of Leadership, and the scientific director of the INSEAD Executive Master in Change. He has received the INSEAD Distinguished Teacher Award five times. He has held professorships at McGill University, the Ecole des Hautes Etudes Commerciales, Montreal, and the Harvard Business School, and has lectured at management institutions around the world.

    Financial Times, Le Capital, Wirtschaftswoche, and The Economist rated Manfred Kets de Vries as one of the world's top fifty leading management thinkers, as well as one of the most influential contributors to human resource management.

    In 2008, he received the Lifetime Achievement Award from the International Leadership Association (the Leadership Legacy Project), being viewed as one of the world’s six founding professionals in the development of leadership as a field and discipline.

    He is the author, co-author or editor of forty-nine books and has published over 400 papers as articles or chapters in books. His books and articles were translated into thirty-one languages. He is a member of seventeen editorial boards.

    Kets de Vries is a consultant on organisational design/transformation and strategic human resource management to leading US, Canadian, European, African, and Asian companies. As an educator and consultant, he has worked in more than forty countries.

    ► Kets De Vries Institute (KDVI) https://kdvi.com/

    Any questions or comments? Press this link and send me a message!

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    49 mins
  • 35. 'Lost In (Business) Transformation' - Rupert Brown
    Dec 14 2025

    'Lost in Business Transformation'

    Despite the fact that there is a solid body of knowledge about the topic of change management for several decades already, McKinsey's infamous notion that '70% of all change management efforts fail' is still seen as adequately representing the current situation.

    Rupert Brown is an experienced chief people officer and change management specialist with extensive expertise in mergers, acquisitions, digital transformation, joint ventures, and turnarounds. Through his book 'Lost in Transformation', Rupert aims to deliver a candid, emotionally intelligent manifesto for doing transformation differently.

    In the 35th episode of the Leadership 2.0 podcast, I interview Rupert about his book and how organizations can ensure the success of their change management efforts.

    • Why Transformation projects continue to fail
    • The difference between Change and Transformation
    • The Bad Reputation of the word 'Transformation'
    • Why we still struggle with Change Management
    • In-Groups and Out-Groups in Change Management Processes
    • Chief Acceleration Officers
    • Trust is Energy
    • Crises as Catalysts for Change
    • The impact of our Permacrisis on Change Management
    • Behavioral Skills to cope with the BANI world'
    • Change Management and AI


    ► About Rupert Brown

    Rupert Brown is an experienced chief people officer and change management specialist with extensive expertise in mergers, acquisitions, digital transformation, joint ventures, and turnarounds. His insights are captured in this book that emphasizes leading change in various organizations.
    Rupert has worked for and advised global multinationals like Procter & Gamble, Gillette, and A.P. Moller-Maersk, as well as nimble, private equity-backed, and family-owned businesses across diverse sectors such as consumer goods, shipping, software, telecommunications, education, and not-for-profit. His knowledge is particularly valuable for those feeling lost in transformation initiatives.

    ► Book https://www.amazon.co.uk/Lost-Transformation-Discover-Leadership-Derailing/dp/B0FQ1FWCKD

    ► Website https://rupert-brown.com/

    Any questions or comments? Press this link and send me a message!

    Show More Show Less
    56 mins
  • 34. ‘Make Innovation Happen - Find The Right Problem To Solve' - Thomas Wedell-Wedellsborg
    Nov 22 2025

    'Adult Innovation'

    Many individuals and organizations wrestle with the question of how they can become more innovative, ... and Thomas Wedell-Wedellsborg has the answers!

    Thomas Wedell-Wedellsborg is the author of What’s Your Problem? (Harvard Business Press, 2020), a book on how to solve the right problems. He is also the co-author (with Paddy Miller) of Innovation as Usual, a Harvard Business Review Press book on the art of driving innovation in regular organizations.

    In the 34th episode of the Leadership 2.0 podcast, I interviewed Thomas Wedell-Wedellsborg about innovation, both at an individual, as well as on an organizational level.

    During our conversation, we discussed the following topics:

    1. Reframing Problems
    2. Weaponizing Frames
    3. Never fall in love with your obstacles
    4. The importance of Bright Spots
    5. The Acid Test for Potential Solutions
    6. The Value of Different Perspectives
    7. Most Ideas are Bad Ideas & Do Not Celebrate Failures
    8. "Focus" versus "Throw Against the Wall and See What Sticks"
    9. How to Ensure Adoption in Corporate Environments (‘Stealthstorming’)
    10. The Past as the Best Predictor of the Future


    ► About Thomas Wedell-Wedellsborg

    Thomas has worked with managers in nearly all parts of the globe, including China, India, Russia, Singapore, Britain, France and his native country, Denmark. His research has been featured in Harvard Business Review, The Economist, The Sunday Times, The Telegraph, BBC Radio, Bloomberg Businessweek and the Financial Times. His work on innovation led HR Magazine to recognize him as a “Top 20 International Thinker”.

    As an executive advisor and keynote speaker, Thomas has addressed organizations such as Cisco, Microsoft, Citigroup, Time Warner, AbbVie, Caterpillar, Amgen, Prudential, Union Pacific, Credit Suisse, Deloitte, the Wall Street Journal, and the United Nations.

    Thomas holds an MA in Media Science from the University of Copenhagen and an MBA from IESE Business School. Prior to his business career, Thomas served for four years as an officer with the Danish Royal Guards.

    ► Five nested strategies to reframe your thinking of a problem to make sure you're solving for the right things:

    1. Look outside the frame. What are we missing?
    2. Rethink the goal. Is there a better objective to pursue?
    3. Examine bright spots. Where is the problem not?
    4. Look in the mirror. What is my/our role in creating this problem?
    5. Take their perspective. What is their problem?

    ► Key actions leaders who want others to act as innovation architects should take

    1. Focus: Direct people to look only for ideas that matter to the business. (Focus beats freedom)
    2. Connect: Urge people to connect to new worlds (customers, colleagues, external experts). (Insight comes from the outside)
    3. Tweak: Challenge people to test, challenge, and reframe their initial ideas repeatedly. (First ideas are flawed)
    4. Select: Guide people to filter and select the best ideas and discard the rest. (Most ideas are bad ideas)
    5. Stealthstorm: Help people navigate the internal organizational politics of innovation. (Stealthstorming rules)
    6. Persist: Motivate everyone to continue pursuing the other five keystone behaviors. (Creativity is a choice)

    ► Books

    ► Website

    Any questions or comments? Press this link and send me a message!

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    39 mins
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