In this episode, Richard Pharro, CEO of APMG International, sits down with a true pioneer of modern business-case development: Joe Flanagan, architect of the Five Case Model and author of internationally adopted guidance for programme and project business cases.

Across a remarkable 45-year career in public service - from HM Treasury to NHS Wales - Joe has helped shape how governments and organisations think, plan, appraise, and invest. Now retired (in theory at least), he continues to support the global Better Business Case community as joint Chief Examiner.

Richard and Joe explore the real purpose of a business case, why proportionality matters, and how the Five Case Model helps decision-makers think “slowly but quickly” by structuring complex choices. Joe shares stories from decades of experience, including surprising workshop outcomes, challenges in major national programmes like IT modernisation and HS2, and how strategic portfolios, options analysis, and the “five Ps” (procurement, project, program, portfolio, policy) create the essential “golden thread” for successful investment.

Joe proceeds to clarify when rigorous analysis is essential and when a lighter touch is more appropriate. He unpacks why organisations so often blur the lines between projects, programmes, and portfolios, and how early scoping, skilled facilitation, and having the right stakeholders in the room can prevent costly misalignment.

Whether you're a practitioner, senior leader, policymaker, or simply curious about how major decisions get made, this conversation offers deep insight into the methods, thinking, and discipline required for robust, defensible business cases.

LINKS:

🌐 Find out more about the Better Business Cases certification: https://apmg-international.com/product/better-business-cases

🌐 Find out more about APMG certifications: apmg-international.com/certifications-solutions

In this episode, Richard Pharro, CEO of APMG International, speaks with Peter Beven about why so many transformation efforts fail, and what leaders must do differently to keep their organisations competitive. Peter challenges conventional thinking, arguing that most organisations still treat people development as an afterthought, even though capability is the single biggest driver of value in any transformation.

Throughout the conversation, Peter unpacks why “digital transformation” is a misleading label, why traditional L&D approaches no longer work, and how organisations can avoid falling into the trap of change for change’s sake. He highlights the uncomfortable truth that nearly half of corporate training investment is wasted, and draws a clear line between poor capability planning and the high failure rate of major projects.

Peter also tackles the rapid rise of AI, explaining the shift from automation to augmentation and why leaders who are only now paying attention may already be behind the curve. He emphasises the growing importance of systems thinking, durable skills, and a culture that enables experimentation; while warning that some industries, including large consulting firms, may struggle to adapt fast enough.

Whether you’re leading a transformation, preparing your workforce for an AI-driven future, or rethinking how to build capability that truly contributes to strategic outcomes, this episode offers a refreshingly direct and thought-provoking perspective. Listen in to explore how to build organisations that are agile, innovative, and ready for what’s coming next.

🔗 Connect with Peter: linkedin.com/in/pbeven
🌐 Find out more about APMG certifications: apmg-international.com/certifications-solutions

In this episode, Richard Pharro, CEO of APMG, speaks with Agnieszka Bochacka, a global leader in digital transformation, academic director, consultant, and author of the world’s first certified digital transformation methodology.

With over a decade of international experience, Agnieszka shares her unique journey from project management to strategy and change leadership across sectors.

A passionate advocate for women in tech, Agnieszka also mentors future leaders, supports start-ups in Central and Eastern Europe, and contributes to communities like PMI and Singularity University. Her proprietary organisational transformation audit model — the subject of PhD research — blends human and technological perspectives for holistic change.

Agnieszka challenges common misconceptions around digital transformation, explaining why it's not just an IT project or one-off initiative, but a continuous, strategic process embedded in an organisation’s DNA. She offers actionable insights on integrating technology with culture, upskilling, and leadership, and highlights why empathy and lifelong learning are essential in today’s rapidly evolving landscape.

Whether you're a business leader, transformation professional, or simply curious about what makes real transformation succeed, this episode delivers practical wisdom and deep strategic insight.

🔗 Connect with Agnieszka: https://www.linkedin.com/in/abochacka/
🌐 Find out more about the Digital Transformation certification: apmg-international.com/product/digital-transformation-certification
🌐 Find out more about APMG certifications: apmg-international.com/certifications-solutions