Risk, Return and Responsibility—the monthly podcast from Sustainable Investor—provides institutional asset owners with the news and views shaping the sustainable investment landscape and our wider economic and social systems.

In this episode, former UK pensions minister Guy Opperman and Sustainable Investor Editorial Director Chris Hall talk to Marisa Hall, Head of the Thinking Ahead Institute (TAI), about the role of asset owners in the evolving landscape of global capital. As a former actuary and now leader of a global not-for-profit investment network, she provides a unique window into how the world’s most influential asset owners are adapting to a "ruptured" global order. From the findings of the TAI’s latest Asset Owner 100 report to the "Moonshot Challenge" of systemic investing, this conversation delves into why traditional investment "buckets" are being broken down in favour of a more dynamic, holistic approach.

● Marisa Hall: Head of the Thinking Ahead Institute ● Guy Opperman: Former UK Pensions Minister and host ● Chris Hall: Editor-in-Chief of Sustainable Investor

• The Power and Concentration of Global Capital: The TAI’s Asset Owner 100 report highlights that the top 100 asset owners control roughly US$30 trillion in capital, with the top 20 "megas" alone commanding 56% of those assets. These organisations are viewed as the "movers and shakers" of the industry, wielding the most influential capital on the planet to shape the future of the global economy.
• The Shift to a Total Portfolio Approach (TPA): Leading asset owners are moving away from traditional strategic asset allocation and rigid asset class "buckets" toward a TPA model where every dollar must compete for capital. This approach serves as a gateway to better sustainability practices by allowing investors to be more dynamic and use real-time information to meet their long-term goals.
• Navigating the Net Zero Plateau through 3D Investing: While 52% of the top 100 asset owners have set net zero targets, new commitments have plateaued. But the challenges to universal owners from interconnected and systemic risks are prompting a shift toward "systems-level investing". This includes a 3D Investing framework that helps asset owners look beyond risk and return to consider the real-world impact their investments have on the systems they rely upon for future returns.
• The Impact of Consolidation and Strategic Partnerships: Consolidation in markets like Australia and the UK is enabling asset owners to build greater internal capability and develop "smart partnerships" with asset managers, based on a shared view of the role of investment capital in driving sustainable growth. This scale allows large funds to be patient, selective, and act as a "critical friend" to their asset managers, ensuring deep alignment with the best long-term interests of their members.
• Geopolitics and AI as Systemic Determinants: Geopolitics has shifted from being a mere driver of returns to a determinant of how the entire investment system functions. Simultaneously, asset owners are building "intelligence ecosystems" to embed AI into their processes, aiming to generate "organisational alpha" by combining technology with human culture and decision-making.

The conversation concludes with a forward-looking assessment of the "Moonshot Challenge"—the idea that investment organisations must understand and address interconnected and systemic risks at source to thrive in an increasingly complex world. Despite a "plateauing" in the announcement of explicit commitments, there is a growing sense of optimism that major asset owners are becoming smarter, more creative, and more resilient in how they integrate sustainability into their investment decisions. By focusing on stewardship, collaboration, and a reset of how we define risk, the leaders of today’s US$30 trillion capital pool are moving into a position to not just navigate the future, but to actively shape it for the generations to come.

Risk, Return and Responsibility—the monthly podcast from Sustainable Investor—provides institutional asset owners with the news and views shaping the sustainable investment landscape and our wider economic and social systems.

In this latest episode, former UK Pensions Minister Guy Opperman and Sustainable Investor Editorial Director Chris Hall are joined by Mike Ambery, Retirement Savings Director at Standard Life, part of the Phoenix Group.

Together, they explore the seismic shifts facing the UK retirement market as it transitions from a legacy of cost-containment toward a future defined by value, scale, and sustainable outcomes.

The discussion unpicks the upcoming Value for Money (VfM) framework and the Pension Schemes Bill, examining how performance metrics will reshape asset allocation and drive industry consolidation. From the ‘herding’ risks seen in Australia to the impact of the Mansion House Compact and shifting geopolitical attitudes toward ESG, the panel identifies the challenges of delivering ‘triple wins’ for government, consumers, and the planet.

Guests: ● Mike Ambery: Retirement Savings Director at Standard Life (Phoenix Group) and a prominent pensions market commentator. ● Guy Opperman: Former UK Pensions Minister and host. ● Chris Hall: Editor-in-Chief of Sustainable Investor.

Interview Highlights: ● Will the Value for Money (VfM) framework truly improve member outcomes? Ambery argues the core purpose of VfM is to improve individual outcomes by looking beyond just investment performance to include service quality. However, the industry must pivot from a cost-based system established in 2012 to one that prizes long-term value and sustainable investment strategies. ● Does the VfM framework conflict with sustainable investment goals? The panel expresses concern that a narrow focus on performance metrics could hinder sustainable investing if not properly implemented. Chris Hall notes that ‘forward-looking’ metrics must be independently assessed and paired with clearer guidance on fiduciary duty regarding systemic risks to ensure sustainability isn't sidelined by short-term data. To reach a ‘triple win’ by 2030, the panel suggests that VfM must be part of a broader package including industrial policy and stewardship. ● Does the Australian model risk creating a ‘herding’ mentality? While consolidation is necessary for scale, Opperman warns that benchmark-driven performance tests can lead to "groupthink" as providers scramble to avoid being in the bottom percentile. Ambery agrees that while "sunlight is the best disinfectant", transparency must be paired with measures that reward diverse, productive asset allocation rather than mere imitation.

● Why is scale critical for the future of sustainable investment? To effectively deploy capital into private markets and sustainable solutions, Ambery suggests firms need significant scale—pointing to Phoenix Group’s £300 billion capacity as an example of what is required to support dedicated research and impact teams. He identifies A$25 billion as a potential minimum threshold for organisations to operate effectively. ● How will global policy trends, including the "Trump impact" affect the City? Despite political rhetoric reclassifying ESG in the US, Ambery believes the UK’s commitment to these factors remains pivotal. Chris Hall notes that as the US takes a differing view, there is an opportunity for a "middle way" led by the UK, EU, and Canada to drive a secure energy transition.

Thanks for joining us: If you like what you hear, you can subscribe to Sustainable Investor and this podcast on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or your preferred platform.

In 2025’s final episode of Risk, Return and Responsibility, the monthly podcast from Sustainable Investor, former UK Pensions Minister Guy Opperman and Editorial Director Chris Hall are joined for an end-of-year reckoning by Dr Anthony Kirby, ex-Head of Regulation and Risk for Asset Management and Capital Markets in Europe at EY.

Together, they review 2025’s big themes and give their views on the questions that will determine sustainable investment returns and impacts 2026:

Is the ESG backlash gathering speed or petering out? With Donald Trump returning to the White House, new hurdles hampered investor scrutiny, while the Inflation Reduction Act was dismantled alongside many a diversity, equity and inclusion initiative. Meanwhile Europe took a scythe to sustainable investment regulation, as finance sector net zero commitments withered. Asset owners dug in, further integrating sustainability into their investment processes and doubling down on oversight of material financial risks - but do they need to do a better job of explaining and delivering outcomes?

Is the divide between asset owners and managers bigger than the Atlantic? Already under huge political and legal pressure, US asset managers faced even greater difficulties in 2025 - with new rules from the Securities and Exchange Commission making it harder to engage with portfolio companies, just as European asset owners underlined their commitment to climate stewardship. The fallout has been measured in lost mandates, but could litigation and retrenchment be on their way in 2026? Effective stewardship of assets could depend on a closing of gaps in both investment horizons and business cultures.

Can private markets deliver both returns and impact at an attractive cost? Institutional investors are increasingly turning to alternative assets to achieve tangible sustainable outcomes as well as superior returns. In markets such as the UK, governments also expect asset owners to achieve the scale to leverage these channels to drive growth too. In response, managers must deliver clear evidence that sustainable business models are driving value creation at every stage of the investment process. Are their reporting cycles, stewardship capabilities, cost and fund structures up to the job?

Will supply meet demand for nature-positive investment opportunities? Nature became a critical stewardship priority for asset owners in 2025 against a backdrop of mixed policy outcomes across plastic pollution, deforestation, and ocean protection. COP30 helped to put nature-related investments on the agenda as asset owners looked beyond measuring and managing risk to seeking out opportunities for returns. Will we see dedicated nature funds or rather nature being fully embedded into a wider range of investment decisions, with impact investment solutions remaining niche for now?

Can the upsides of the AI boom survive the downsides of a bust? Hopes for transformative productivity gains from AI innovation have allowed markets to face down all headwinds in 2025. Even so, investors wonder when returns will justify capex and whether ESG risks will be addressed. Despite the rising valuations, careful analysis is needed to invest in AI, its infrastructure and supply chain - and to identify the sectors using the technology to deliver higher returns. 2026 could also see more asset owners and managers deploying AI to deliver new insights into sustainability-related risks and opportunities.