The Christopher Perrin Show cover art

The Christopher Perrin Show

The Christopher Perrin Show

Written by: Christopher Perrin
Listen for free

About this listen

 Dr. Christopher Perrin has been a leader in the renewal of classical education in the United States for 25 years. In this podcast, he traces the renewal of the American paideia exploring the recent history of the American renaissance in light of the 2500 years that have preceded it. Christopher is the founding CEO of Classical Academic Press and the founder of ClassicalU.com. The Christopher Perrin Show is part of the TrueNorth.fm podcast network.©TrueNorth.fm Social Sciences
Episodes
  • Episode 59: American Education: What It Was and Can Be Again

    Episode 59: American Education: What It Was and Can Be Again
    Apr 15 2026
    Description Recorded at the 2026 Great Hearts National Symposium on February 25, 2026, this edited episode features Christopher Perrin’s keynote speech exploring the history, meaning, and renewal of classical education, asking a foundational question: what exactly are we trying to recover? Drawing from sources as diverse as Augustine, Herodotus, Tocqueville, and C.S. Lewis, he traces the transmission of the liberal arts from ancient Greece and Rome through Christendom and into early America. Along the way, Perrin reflects on the gradual fragmentation of this tradition in the modern era, illustrated through the story of the Adams family and the rise of progressive education. Perrin challenges educators to embrace the humility at the heart of true learning—that the more we know, the more we recognize our ignorance—and to see themselves as perpetual students. The episode also highlights the remarkable resurgence of classical education today, describing it as a reawakening of seeds long buried but now beginning to flourish. Perrin emphasizes that education is not merely a science or technique, but the transmission of a living tradition aimed at forming wisdom, virtue, and love. Listeners will come away with a renewed sense of purpose, encouraged to tend the “fire” of learning and to participate faithfully in handing down a rich inheritance to the next generation.Special thanks to the Great Hearts Institute. Episode OutlineWhy the question “What is classical education?” is harder than it sounds (and why it matters for renewal)The paradox of learning: the more you know, the more you know you don’t know “Begin with the end”: death, wisdom, and the purpose of education Tradition as “handing down”: language, culture, and education as inheritance Athens and Rome: Greek paideia, Roman educatio, and the liberal arts as a transmitted curriculumThe Church and Christendom: incorporating Greco-Roman learning, theology as “queen,” and widening accessEngland to early America: grammar schools, Boston Latin, Harvard, and the rise of popular literacy The Adams family as an educational case study: formation, thinning, and the modern fracture Progressive education: what changed, what was gained, and why education can’t be reduced to a quantitative scienceThe modern renewal: early schools (1979–1981), today’s ecosystem, and the need for teacher formation at scaleFinal exhortation: preserve humility, avoid pride, resist false dichotomies, and tend the “fire” of wonder in schoolsKey Topics & TakeawaysClassical education is a tradition before it is a “renewal.” A renewal only makes sense if we can name what is being renewed.Teachers must be perpetual students. The classical teacher models humility—seeking wisdom while resisting the pretense of having arrived.Education is measured by ultimate aims. Human life is fleeting; education gains its meaning from what it prepares us for—virtue, wisdom, piety, and a life rightly ordered.Tradition is unavoidable. Even rejecting tradition requires using language and capacities that were first handed down as a tradition.The liberal arts are an inheritance with a genealogy. From Greek and Roman culture through Christian adaptation, the arts endure because they correspond to human nature.Modern fragmentation reshaped education’s purpose. When technology and “force” become central categories, education shifts from transmitting culture to preparing for flux.Progressive vs. classical is not a simple binary. Many educational “heresies” are partial truths held out of balance (false dichotomies distort practice).The renewal must be sustained by love, not mere critique. A movement fueled only by opposition cannot endure—formation requires positive vision and shared goods.Classical education belongs to humanity. It is deeply shaped by Christianity, but not owned exclusively by Christians; it welcomes seekers and strangers.Questions & DiscussionWhy do you think “classical education” is so difficult to define clearly?Name what you most often hear from parents or colleagues when they ask what “classical” means. Try writing a two-sentence definition that includes both aim (why) and means (how), then compare with others.How does the “perpetual student” posture change the way you teach?Where are you tempted to project certainty or expertise instead of wonder and humility? Identify one practice that would help your faculty model learning (shared reading, teacher seminar, public “I don’t know yet”).What is education for when you “begin with the end” (mortality in view)?How does remembering death sharpen what matters in curriculum and school culture? If you had to prioritize one outcome—wisdom, virtue, piety, civic responsibility—what would you choose and why?What can we learn from the Adams family arc—formation to fracture?In your own experience, where do you see education becoming “garments that no longer fit”? ...
    Show More Show Less
    1 hr and 11 mins
  • Episode 58: The Divided Soul and the Prodigal Pattern: Duty, Desire, and the Way Home

    Episode 58: The Divided Soul and the Prodigal Pattern: Duty, Desire, and the Way Home
    Mar 25 2026
    DescriptionChristopher Perrin welcomes author and speaker Heidi White to discuss her book The Divided Soul and the inner conflict so many people experience between duty and desire. Along the way, Perrin draws on his own work, The Good Teacher, to frame how educators can unite discipline and delight as they form students’ loves. White traces her path from homeschooling into classical education, then explains how a single remark from Andrew Kern—about the Prodigal Son—sparked a long meditation on the “two brothers” within the human heart. From Genesis to Augustine, and from Dante to Homer, they explore how disordered desire can lead either to indulgence (the prodigal) or to self-righteous suppression (the older brother). Perrin and White rehabilitate the language of desire—eros, longing, even the “stars” behind the word desire—as a force meant for joy and union when properly ordered. The conversation turns practical as White describes classroom habits, “much, not many,” and Socratic discussion as ways to unite discipline and delight in student learning. The episode closes with where to find White’s work, including The Divided Soul, her Substack, and The Close Reads community.Episode OutlineHeidi White’s journey: homeschooling, recovering her own education, and entering the classical renewalThe Divided Soul: how the Prodigal Son becomes a template for understanding interior conflictGenesis and the Fall: how desire and duty fracture, and why the rupture shapes every human dilemmaRehabilitating desire: eros, “chaste eros,” fasting and feasting, and longing for heavenAugustine and the divided will: why we do what we hate and resist what we loveTeaching implications: habits, formation, music practice, and the slow education of desireClassroom practice: reading “much, not many,” annotation, handwriting, and Socratic discussionGreat books as living feasts: why students return to Austen, Dante, Homer, and others across a lifetimeKey Topics & TakeawaysThe “two brothers” within us: White argues that the prodigal’s appetite and the older brother’s resentment both live in the same soul—and healing requires reconciliation, not victory by one side.The Fall fractures what paradise joined: In Eden, duty and desire were aligned; sin introduces a traumatic division that echoes through every choice, habit, and temptation.Desire needs rehabilitation, not elimination: Desire is not “for” self-indulgence or suppression, but for joy—ultimately a longing for union with God that remains incomplete this side of eternity.Fasting is a pedagogy of desire: Self-denial isn’t contempt for pleasure; it’s training appetite toward a higher good—because “the purpose of the fast is the feast.”Great teaching makes room for gift: Dutiful habits (reading, writing, practice) create conditions where wonder can “break in” unexpectedly through truth, goodness, and beauty.“Much, not many” restores attention: Classical pedagogy resists “covering content” and instead invites slow, meaningful encounters that students can return to for decades.Love is the bridge between duty and desire: The teacher’s “office” (officium) is fulfilled in benevolent love—guiding the student into communion with the artifact and the joy it holds.Questions & DiscussionWhere do you see the “two brothers” in yourself: indulgence or self-righteous suppression?Identify one area where you chase satisfaction “on your own terms” and one area where you deny desire through resentment or control. What would reconciliation look like—practically—in the next week?How does the Prodigal Son illuminate your relationships (family, faculty, friendships)?Where do you see the temptation to label others as “that son of yours” rather than “this brother of yours”? What practices might restore relationship instead of reinforcing distance?What is desire for in your community’s imagination?Compare two instincts: “fulfill every appetite” vs. “want nothing.” Which dominates your environment?How could you articulate desire as ordered toward joy, union, and holiness? How can teachers unite rigor and joy in a classroom? How can teachers unite rigor and joy in a classroom?Identify one duty you want to strengthen (annotation, narration, memorization, problem sets). Pair it with one practice of delight (Socratic discussion, shared reading, seminar questions that touch real student longings).Suggested Reading & ResourcesThe Divided Soul by Heidi WhiteThe Good Teacher by Christopher Perrin PhD and Carrie Eben MSeDNorms and Nobility by David HicksSt. Augustine’s Confessions by St. Augustine The Odyssey by Homer The Prodigal Son - Luke 15 The CiRCE InstituteClassical Academic PressClose Reads Community Heidi White's SubstackChristopher Perrin’s Substack
    Show More Show Less
    1 hr and 27 mins
  • Episode 57: Remembering Well: Restoring History Through Sympathy, Story, and Place

    Episode 57: Remembering Well: Restoring History Through Sympathy, Story, and Place
    Feb 25 2026
    DescriptionAndrew Zwerneman, writer and narrator for HISTORY250® and co-founder and president of Cana Academy, joins Christopher Perrin to argue that America’s cultural crisis is, at root, a crisis of memory—and that renewing history education is a work of restoration. Zwerneman traces the teachers, places, and lived experiences that formed him as a historian, then explains why the “liberal discipline of history” must resist ideological reduction and return to observation, sympathy, and fidelity to the past. Along the way, they connect historical remembrance to the deepest human questions: personhood, responsibility, freedom, and the moral imagination that societies inherit. The conversation explores how biblical and classical sources shaped the American founding, how later leaders invoked inherited principles to confront slavery and injustice, and why the West’s habit of self-criticism depends on conserving what came before. Zwerneman introduces Cana Academy and its HISTORY250® project as practical efforts to rebuild shared story through films, primary sources, maps, and teacher formation. The episode closes with a vivid picture of what great history instruction looks like: students learning to read documents, geography, art, and narrative so they can live under a shared story and recover “hallowed ground.”Episode OutlineZwerneman’s formation: family travel, early teachers, and awakening to the moral weight of historyWhy remembrance is central to human and Christian life: Exodus, Passover, and “do this in remembrance of me”Rejecting “history as a force”: recovering human agency, personhood, and moral dramaAmerican inheritance: scripture, ordered liberty, common law, and natural law in the foundingLearning from paradox: freedom and slavery at the founding; reform movements that appeal to founding idealsThe liberal discipline of history: observation, sympathy, and resisting ideologyWhat students should study: imagery, narratives, structures, data, geography, and the craft of storyCana Academy and HISTORY250®: films, documents, maps, and a “gift” aimed at cultural renewalA tour of the ideal classical history classroom: what you’d see, hear, and practiceKey Topics & TakeawaysHistory restores identity: A people who lose their story lose a clear sense of who they are—and what they owe to the dead and the unborn.Human agency is central: Against “history as a force,” the episode insists that persons mediate between past and present through decisions, sacrifices, and responsibilities.Ordered liberty requires memory: American freedom is rooted in inherited sources (biblical imagination, British rights, common law, natural law), and it decays when citizens forget the responsibilities that attend freedom.History trains moral realism without moralizing: Sympathy is not excuse-making; it is the disciplined effort to understand the human condition before passing judgment.The classroom must return to concrete realities: Great history teaching works from maps, artifacts, documents, portraits, letters, diaries, and place—so students learn “what actually happened.”Shared story creates shared sympathies: Art, poetry, and narrative shape communal feeling and help students situate their lives in a meaningful inheritance.Renewal is practical: Teacher formation, curated primary sources, and accessible tools (films, documents, maps) are presented as tangible ways to fight cultural amnesia.Questions & DiscussionWhat does it mean to study the past “in its pastness”?Discuss why people in the past may act in ways we do not recognize—or approve. How can teachers pursue truth without turning history into propaganda or therapy?How do observation and sympathy change the way we teach hard topics (war, slavery, injustice)?Identify one topic where your students tend to moralize quickly or dismissively. What sources (letters, diaries, speeches, laws, artifacts) could slow them down into careful understanding?What’s the difference between “ordered liberty” and “license”?Describe a modern example where freedom is framed as “doing whatever I want.” What habits, texts, or stories could help students reconnect freedom to responsibility and the common good?Which leaders or movements best model “reform by remembering”? Compare at least two examples discussed (e.g., Douglass, Lincoln, King, Chavez). What did each retrieve from the past to address present suffering?What belongs in a strong history curriculum besides a textbook? Make a list under five headings: imagery, narratives, structural analysis, data, and geography. Choose one heading and propose one new classroom routine (weekly map-reading, document lab, portrait study, artifact analysis, narrative-writing).What would you see in a “great classical upper school” history class?Describe the sounds and practices: seminar discussion, source analysis, narration, map work, interpretive writing, and shared reading. What is...
    Show More Show Less
    1 hr and 15 mins
No reviews yet