Werner Kraus leads robotics research at Fraunhofer IPA, where 1,000 engineers work on production systems and the unglamorous infrastructure that makes humanoids commercially viable: standards. Not the headline-grabbing demos, but the 30-40 tests required before a robot can enter a semiconductor clean room. The certification processes that determine if particle emissions from gear grease will contaminate pharmaceuticals. The biomechanical measurements proving that 500 Newtons of collision force is 3x too high for human safety.

Standards enable commercialization. Without them, you can't get insurance. You can't satisfy business buyers. You can't scale beyond pilot programs. Werner's team at Fraunhofer IPA does the methodical work of defining what "safe" and "clean" actually mean in measurable terms—then working with ISO committees and robot manufacturers to close the gaps between current performance and certification requirements.

I sat down with Werner to explore how clean room certification works across nine ISO classes, why the Unitree G1 currently achieves ISO Class 5 (semiconductor standard), what 500 Newtons of collision force actually means for human safety, and the surprising discovery his team made about data transmission to China when testing cybersecurity.

Werner walks through the reality that robots themselves are contamination sources—emitting particles from wear, harboring dirt in crevices, and requiring steel surfaces instead of coatings in pharma environments. He explains why energy efficiency standards matter (the Unitree consumes 280W and requires battery swaps every 100 minutes), how ISO/TS 15066 sets different force limits for different body regions, and why his team consults with manufacturers on design changes to improve safety ratings rather than simply issuing pass/fail grades.

Clean room certification, collision biomechanics, ISO standards development, cybersecurity testing, energy consumption benchmarking—top concepts covered. But what struck me most was the systematic rigor: not rushing humanoids to market, but methodically defining the thresholds that protect both workers and product integrity.

That is a robot future built on engineering discipline rather than hype cycles.

00:00 Introduction: Why Standards Enable Commercialization
00:45 Fraunhofer IPA: 1,000 Engineers Working on Standards
02:15 Collision Safety: 500 Newtons is 3-4x Too High
04:30 Clean Room Certification: Nine ISO Classes, 30-40 Tests
06:20 Robots Themselves Emit Contaminants
07:45 Energy Efficiency: 280W Consumption, 100-Minute Battery Life
09:10 Cybersecurity Discovery: Data Transmission to China Confirmed
10:30 Consulting with Manufacturers on Design Improvements

• 500N = 112 lbs of force – The Unitree G1's collision force is 3-4x the ISO/TS 15066 safe limit of ~150N for human contact

• ISO Class 5 for semiconductors – Current humanoid clean room capability, with 30-40 distinct tests required for certification

• 100-minute battery life – Unitree G1 at 280W consumption; future high-density batteries targeting 4-8 hour shifts

• Cybersecurity confirmed – Testing verified Unitree robots transmit data to China when connected to internet

• Robots contaminate too – Gear grease, wear particles, surface materials, and edge geometry all create clean room challenges

Werner Kraus is Head of Robotics at Fraunhofer IPA (Institute for Manufacturing Engineering and Automation) in Stuttgart, Germany. He leads standards development and certification testing for collaborative and humanoid robots, working directly with ISO committees and manufacturers on safety, clean room, and performance requirements.

Turn the Lens explores the future of work, technology adoption, and the human side of innovation. Hosted by Jeff Frick, the show features in-depth conversations with leaders shaping how we'll work tomorrow.

This interview is a collaboration between Turn the Lens and Humanoids Summit, and was conducted at Humanoids Summit SV, Computer History Museum, Mountain View, California, December 2025. Humanoids Summit is organized and hosted by ALM Ventures.

Learn more:
Humanoids Summit: www.humanoidssummit.com

Turn the Lens: www.turnthelenspodcast.com

Work 20XX: www.work20xx.com

Chris Kudla, Co-Founder and CEO of Mind Children, explains why his company is building social humanoid robots instead of utility workers. While most humanoids focus on warehouse tasks and manufacturing, Mind Children is tackling the harder problem: creating robots for education, healthcare, hospitality, and elder care—applications where empathy and emotional connection matter most.

In this conversation from Humanoids Summit 2025, Chris walks through the challenging engineering problem of avoiding the "Uncanny Valley"—that unsettling feeling when robots look almost, but not quite, human. He explains Mind Children's deliberate design choices for their prototype Codey: a 3-foot tall robot with a gray silicone face, nine servo motors creating expressions, and proportions intentionally kept away from human-like features to stay "just right."

KEY TOPICS:

• Why social humanoids require different engineering than utility robots

• The Uncanny Valley phenomenon and strategies to avoid it

• Codey's animatronic face: 9 servo motors with silicone skin

• How children naturally engage with robots versus screens

• Teachers using humanoids as in-class assistants for breakout sessions

• Students teaching concepts back to Codey to reinforce learning

• The comfort animal analogy: empowering workers, not replacing them

• Spinning off from SingularityNET's open-source AI research

• MVP roadmap: 10-30 pilot units by late 2026

STANDOUT QUOTES: "We're building a social humanoid robot. Everything revolves around human interaction—education, health care, hospitality—applications where empathy really matters."

"When we put Codey in front of children, they just run up and want to talk to him. They're not looking at a screen—they're actually communicating in the real world."

"We made the face gray. A gray face is not very human, but it still maintains emotional expressiveness while staying as far away from the Uncanny Valley as we can be."

"A really effective learning method is for the student to teach it back to someone else. Students could actually teach Codey, and that reinforces their own learning."

ABOUT CHRIS KUDLA: Chris Kudla is Co-Founder and CEO of Mind Children, leading development of empathetic humanoid robots for social applications. The company originated as a spinoff from SingularityNET, an open-source, decentralized AI research organization focused on beneficial AI development. Mind Children is currently mid-seed round with plans to deploy pilot units in education and healthcare settings by late 2026.

PRODUCTS DISCUSSED:

• Codey: 3-foot tall social humanoid with animatronic face, motorized wheeled base, and mechanical arms/legs designed for educational and healthcare applications

This interview was conducted in collaboration with Humanoids Summit SV 2025. Humanoids Summit is organized by ALM Ventures.

LINKS:
Mind Children : https://mindchildren.com
SingularityNET: https://singularitynet.io
Humanoids Summit: https://humanoidssummit.com
Turn the Lens: https://turnthelenspodcast.com

Turn the Lens explores how technology impacts work, organizations, and human potential through in-depth conversations with innovators shaping the future of work.

#HumanoidRobotics #SocialRobots #EmpatheticAI #EducationTechnology #UncannyValley #MindChildren #HumanoidsSummit #FutureOfWork #HumanoidsSummit #TurnTheLens

Joe Michaels, SVP of Sales and Marketing at 1HMX, explains why haptic feedback and teleoperation are critical for training humanoid robots. While synthetic data and video help robots learn basics, the fine-tuning that makes them truly functional comes from human operators using advanced haptic gloves with 135 points of tactile feedback.

In this conversation from Humanoids Summit 2025, Joe walks through how HaptX's microfluidic technology creates realistic touch sensations, why video training alone can't handle dexterous manipulation, and how the newly announced Nexus NX1 full-body system enables operators to control humanoid robots with their entire body.

KEY TOPICS:

• Why 20-degree-of-freedom robot hands require human teleoperation
• How 135 tactile actuators provide bidirectional feedback loops
• The microfluidic technology behind realistic touch sensation
• Training robots to handle corner cases and edge situations
• Why industry standards matter more than proprietary solutions
• Full-body teleoperation with Nexus NX1 (shipping Q2 2026)
• The economics of robot-as-a-service versus ownership models
• Safety challenges in deploying powerful machines near humans

STANDOUT QUOTES:
"There's a dream of just showing enough video to robots so they can do everything. But that's really not how humans or robots learn complicated things."

"When you take away someone's sense of touch, their capabilities drop off tremendously. Bringing that back into the robot equation creates a closed loop that makes a very natural and powerful control system."

"Today's humanoids are getting dexterous—20 degree of freedom robot hands with five digits. You're not going to control that with video. You need to teach that how to behave."

"When mobility comes into the picture, you don't want to just control it with an Xbox controller. Your full body should be involved. That's what Nexus NX1 is about."

ABOUT JOE MICHAELS:
Joe Michaels is Senior Global Vice President of Sales and Marketing at 1HMX (formerly HaptX). With 20+ years building strategic partnerships at Microsoft and as co-founder of Nexchange Corporation, Joe brings deep expertise in emerging technology commercialization. He holds an MBA from The Wharton School and undergraduate degree from Georgetown University.

PRODUCTS DISCUSSED:

• HaptX Gloves G1: 135 tactile actuators, 40 lbs force feedback, sub-millimeter motion tracking
• Nexus NX1: First whole-body teleoperation system combining HaptX Gloves, Virtuix Omni One treadmill, Freeaim robotic shoes, and 72-DOF motion capture

This interview was conducted in collaboration with Humanoids Summit 2025, organized by ALM Ventures at the Computer History Museum in Mountain View, California.

LINKS:
1HMX: https://www.1hmx.com
HaptX Gloves: https://haptx.com/gloves-g1/
Nexus NX1: https://www.1hmx.com/nexus
Humanoids Summit: https://humanoidssummit.com
Turn the Lens: https://turnthelenspodcast.com

Turn the Lens explores how technology impacts work, organizations, and human potential through in-depth conversations with innovators shaping the future of work.

#HumanoidRobotics #Teleoperation #HapticFeedback #RobotTraining #EmbodiedAI #HaptX #FutureOfWork

Jeremy Fishel, Principal Scientist at Sanctuary AI, explores why human hands remain robotics' greatest challenge and most important breakthrough opportunity.

With nearly two decades of research in tactile sensing, dexterity, and manipulation, Jeremy brings unique insights into why replicating the human hand is exponentially harder than achieving robot vision or locomotion. He discusses a surprising control paradox: humans struggle to master simple machines like excavators (4 degrees of freedom) yet effortlessly control the complexity of our hands and arms (50+ degrees of freedom). The answer lies in millions of years of evolutionary optimization—and this creates a unique opportunity for robotics.

In this conversation, Jeremy explains:

• Why tactile sensing involves more complex physics than vision—it's active interaction, not passive observation

• The multiple sensing modalities in hands: force, texture, slip detection, thermal sensing, contact geometry

• Why manipulation is fundamentally about slipping and sliding, not static grasping

• The durability paradox: creating soft, compliant surfaces that survive years of real-world use

• Why Sanctuary AI chose hydraulic actuation for their dexterous hands

• How teleoperation allows robots to learn human manipulation intelligence without evolutionary timescales

• The three reasons people cite for human-like hands (and which one actually matters most)

• Sanctuary AI's upcoming next-generation dexterous hand announcement

Recorded at Humanoids Summit 2025, December 11-12, at the Computer History Museum in Mountain View, California. This interview is part of our ongoing collaboration with Humanoids Summit, organized by ALM Ventures.

Jeremy previously founded Tangible Research (acquired by Sanctuary AI in 2023) and co-founded SynTouch, developing the groundbreaking BioTac tactile sensor. His research has been cited over 2,000 times and includes pioneering work on Bayesian exploration for tactile object identification.

Host: Jeff Frick Production: Turn the Lens / Work 20XX Event Partner: Humanoids Summit, ALM Ventures

Show Notes, References, Links and resources: https://www.turnthelenspodcast.com/episodes

YouTube - https://youtu.be/vpk-QgPO6X4

Jeff Burnstein, President of the Association for Advancing Automation (A3), reveals why eight countries have national robotics strategies while America doesn't—and what four decades of industrial robot history teaches us about humanoid adoption.

In this interview from Humanoids Summit SV 2025, Jeff explains the critical role of safety standards in commercialization, why Japan's 1960s strategy created sustained leadership while China dominates today, and how A3 is reframing "robotics" as "embodied AI" to gain traction in Washington D.C.

Key Topics:

• Why national robotics strategies drive competitive advantage

• Safety standards: from 1986 industrial robots to 2025 humanoids

• Cultural barriers: Hollywood's Terminator vs. Japan's friendly robots

• Hospital robotics: the under-recognized opportunity beyond manufacturing

• Historical lessons: hype cycles, dark periods, and realistic timelines

• Data privacy and AI training data issues for home robots

About Jeff Burnstein:
Jeff is President of the Association for Advancing Automation (A3), leading the organization's standards development, industry advocacy, and policy work including the push for a National Robotics Strategy. A3 developed the first American national robot safety standard in 1986, which became the basis for international ISO standards. With four decades in the robotics industry, Jeff witnessed the first industrial robot revolution and brings essential perspective on adoption cycles and commercialization barriers.

Resources:
Association for Advancing Automation (A3): https://www.automate.org

World Robot Conference (Beijing): https://www.worldrobotconference.com

This interview is co-released by Turn the Lens and Humanoids Summit. Humanoids Summit is organized and hosted by ALM Ventures.

Recorded at the Humanoids Summit SV 2025, Computer History Museum, Mountain View, California.

For more on Humanoids Summit, including May 2026 in Tokyo visit https://humanoidssummit.com/

For more from Humanoids Summit SV https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iRz7mBlytVs&list=PLJCOPK6OJb1CLbLLXmBCS9sQPTj3kyE-F

Jeff Burnstein: Robotics Imperative, Standards, National Strategy | Turn the Lens with Jeff Frick Ep49

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Ed Colgate, Northwestern University, and Director of the HAND ERC reveals why the secret to dexterous manipulation isn't precision engineering, but something surprisingly simple: softness and large contact areas.

In this conversation from Humanoids Summit 2025, Ed explains the fundamental difference between human and robot manipulation, how AI finally enables control of complex hands, and why artificial muscles might solve the chronic overheating problem.

Key Topics: • Why large soft contact areas matter more than finger articulation • How softness enables sensing and control, not just collision safety • The HAND ERC: 5 universities, 33 faculty tackling robotics' hardest problem • AI-enhanced prosthetics bridging the brain-machine interface bandwidth gap • Artificial muscles using thermal, light, and electrical stimulation • The "beautiful negotiation" of dexterity between humans and environment • Why motion smoothness dramatically affects human acceptance of robots

About Ed Colgate: Ed is a Professor at Northwestern University and Director of the HAND ERC (Human AugmentatioN via Dexterity Engineering Research Center), a major NSF-funded initiative bringing together MIT, Carnegie Mellon, Florida A&M, and Texas A&M. The center focuses on advanced hardware, AI control systems, and human-robot interfaces with a decade-long mission to develop dexterous robots that help people be more productive.

Recorded at Humanoids Summit 2025, Computer History Museum, Mountain View, California

Links & Resources: • HAND ERC: [URL] • Northwestern University Robotics: [URL] • Ed Colgate Faculty Page: [URL] • Humanoids Summit: https://humanoidssummit.com • Full show notes: [your website URL/episode] • Video version: https://youtu.be/rO_miJL--n4

What surprised you most about the role of softness in robotic hands? Share your thoughts on our website or social media.

About This Series: Part of our comprehensive coverage from Humanoids Summit 2025, featuring 10+ conversations with leaders in embodied AI and robotics.

More Humanoids Summit Interviews: • Carolina Parada (Google DeepMind) • Pete Florence (Physical Intelligence) • Jeff Burnstein (A3 - Association for Advancing Automation)

This interview is co-released by Turn the Lens and Humanoids Summit. Humanoids Summit is organized and hosted by ALM Ventures.

Recorded at the Humanoids Summit SV 2025, Computer History Museum, Mountain View, California.

Subscribe for more interviews on the future of work, AI adoption, robotics, and organizational change.

Nic Radford, Co-founder and CEO of Persona AI, sits down with Jeff Frick at Humanoids Summit 2025 (presented by ALM Ventures) to unpack a hard truth: robots aren't difficult to build—they're difficult to make useful.

Radford's career arc reads like a tour of extreme environments: NASA space robotics, deep ocean exploration, and now shipbuilding automation. Each demanded solving communication, distance, and harsh conditions. This time, he's focused squarely on commercial viability from the start.

His framework for finding the right market is brilliant: look beyond the traditional "3Ds" (dirty, dull, dangerous) to the fourth D—declining labor supply. But not just any shortage. Radford specifically targets industries where workers are well-compensated, the labor pool is shrinking, and companies are open to innovation. That intersection led him to shipbuilding and the skilled trade of welding.

The technical insight? Focus on generalizable skills, not general-purpose robots. Welding represents tool manipulation within defined rules—a capability that extends to painting, grinding, and other skilled trades requiring precision with tools.

But the conversation goes beyond technology. Radford addresses the non-technical barriers that can kill adoption: insurance, liability, ethics, and regulatory frameworks. He reveals that Persona's first advisory board hire was an ethics committee chair. Drawing parallels to autonomous vehicles, he explains why insurance companies struggle with accidents "at the hands of a machine," even when overall fatality rates drop dramatically.

After three robotics ventures, Radford finally has the convergence he needs: capable AI, willing investors, and most importantly, customer partnerships embedded from day one. He's tired, but he couldn't stay away from the opportunity.

This interview is co-released by Turn the Lens and Humanoids Summit. Humanoids Summit is organized and hosted by ALM Ventures.

Recorded at the Humanoids Summit SV 2025, Computer History Museum, Mountain View, California.

Transcript and Extensive Show Notes

YouTube

For more on Humanoids Summit, including May 2026 Summit in Tokyo visit
https://humanoidssummit.com/

For more from Humanoids Summit SV
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9mbbeOzRPQk&list=PLJCOPK6OJb1CLbLLXmBCS9sQPTj3kyE-F