Part 3: Doulas Escorted Out, Birth Outcome, and the Aftermath

In the final installment of the series, doulas Sheila Lawrence and Jain McKinney describe being repeatedly removed from a hospital labor room after a breech client’s care became entangled in provider resistance, bias, and shifting “chain of command.” After the client received an epidural, an older white male OB told the doulas he needed the mother alone to confirm decisions; despite this, county police and hospital security ultimately escorted the doulas out of the building, refused to let them say goodbye, retrieved their belongings, attempted to have them sign a visitor behavior policy, and restricted FaceTime. The doulas feared arrest and retaliation and remained nearby while coordinating by text; the baby was born by cesarean around 11:21 AM the next day. They discuss misinformation online, legal guidance, delays in going public until discharge, trauma and “weathering,” and the painful loss of contact with the mother amid public scrutiny.

00:00 Part Three Setup

01:34 Back In The Room

02:24 Epidural And Power Play

04:26 Waiting Outside Doors

05:47 Police Removal Order

07:52 Visitor Policy Pressure

09:20 Escorted Out In Fear

13:52 Parking Garage Debrief

15:25 Texts And Birth Outcome

17:03 Clearing The Record

20:39 Postpartum Distance

24:20 Why They Went Public

25:41 Choosing When To Speak

26:01 Life Keeps Moving

27:28 Facing The Public Fallout

28:48 Weathering And Retraumatization

31:44 Doulas As Untapped Resource

33:21 Support Systems And Doubt

36:22 Witnesses And Healing

38:07 Shera On The Disconnect

40:18 Returning To The Hospital

44:20 Faith And Vindication

46:16 How The Podcast Happened

47:36 Final Blessings And Wrap

In Part 2 of this powerful three-part series, we continue the firsthand account from Shira Lawrence and Jet’aime McKinney as they navigate an increasingly complex and high-stakes hospital experience during a birth in Georgia.

What begins as a moment of hope—with a provider finally listening—quickly shifts into a deeper examination of power, bias, and control within the hospital system.

This episode captures the tension between advocacy and authority, and what it means to support a laboring mother while systems actively resist that support.

1. A rare moment of alignment with a provider who listens—and why it mattered
2. The role of the anesthesiologist in shifting the trajectory of care
3. How doulas are perceived, dismissed, and sometimes erased in clinical spaces
4. The critical importance of advocacy when a client cannot advocate for themselves
5. The emotional and psychological labor of doulas during prolonged, high-pressure situations
6. Hospital policies vs. practice: how “rules” are inconsistently applied
7. The escalation from support to surveillance—and the introduction of hospital security
8. The moment advocacy becomes risk—and the fear that enters the room

1. Advocacy vs. Authority

Even when care is medically appropriate, access can be delayed or denied based on provider bias or resistance.

2. The Doula’s Role Is Not Optional—It’s Essential

This episode reinforces why families choose doulas: for advocacy, clarity, and grounded support in moments where systems become overwhelming.

3. Bias in Real Time

Listeners will hear how bias shows up not just in decisions—but in tone, access, communication, and escalation.

4. Emotional Labor of Birth Workers

Beyond physical support, doulas are navigating systems, protecting clients, and managing their own safety simultaneously.

5. Systems Under Pressure Reveal Truth

Moments of stress expose how institutions operate—and who they prioritize.

This episode ends in the middle of an intense and unfolding situation:

1. The client is in active labor without pain management
2. Hospital dynamics have escalated
3. Security has entered the room
4. The doulas are being confronted and pressured to leave

Part 3 will take you into the final removal, the aftermath, and the lasting psychological impact of this experience—along with what ultimately happened to mom and baby.

This episode contains descriptions of medical stress, confrontation, and systemic challenges within birth settings. Listener discretion is advised.

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🌐 www.doulathatpodcast.com, IG:@DoulaThatPodcast, YouTube: Doula That! Podcast

What stood out to you in this episode?

Have you experienced or witnessed similar dynamics in birth spaces?

Drop your thoughts in the comments—we want to hear from you.

Ravae Sinclair, JD, CLC, PBD(NBPP), PPD(NBPP)

Dr. Denise Bolds

doulathatpodcast@gmail.com

We’re relaunching the Doula That! Podcast with a conversation that requires depth, context, and care.

In this episode, we sit down with Black doulas Shira Lawrence and Jet’aime McKinney to begin unpacking the story behind a viral video showing their removal from a hospital birth.

This is Part 1 of a 3-part series, where we intentionally move beyond headlines and social media assumptions to center their lived experience, professional insight, and the full context of what occurred.

This episode lays the foundation—who they are, how they practice, and what led up to the hospital encounter.

1. The intention behind this conversation: listening over speculation
2. Shira and Jet’aime’s backgrounds in education, birth work, and community care
3. What it means to serve families in a maternal health desert
4. The client’s journey navigating limited provider options in rural Georgia
5. Why the family made the decision to travel to the Atlanta area for birth
6. The behind-the-scenes realities of doula support (logistics, planning, advocacy)
7. How hospital systems operate through hierarchy, policy, and liability
8. Early signs of bias, miscommunication, and resistance in triage
9. The critical moment when a breech diagnosis shifts the course of care
10. The client’s clear request for pain management vs. provider insistence on cesarean

1. Patient Autonomy vs. Hospital Policy
2. Bias and Communication in Birth Spaces
3. The Role of Doulas as Advocates and Care Partners
4. Access Gaps in Rural Maternal Healthcare
5. What Happens When Systems Don’t Listen

Shira Lawrence

Birth & Postpartum Doula, Trainer, and Childbirth Educator.

Founder of a nonprofit supporting vulnerable teenage girls.

Serves families in maternal health deserts, often navigating high-risk and limited-access environments.

Jet’aime McKinney

Birth & Postpartum Doula, Agency Owner, and Educator based in Metro Atlanta.

Former educator turned full-time birth worker after a personal birth experience transformed her path.

Supports families through advocacy, education, and community-centered care.

This episode is grounded in the doulas’ firsthand account.

We are not providing legal advice or speaking on behalf of the hospital or medical team.

Our goal is to create space for clarity, understanding, and informed dialogue.

This is Part 1 of a 3-part series.

👉 Part 2 drops soon—be sure to subscribe and turn on notifications so you don’t miss what happens next.

Ravae Sinclair and Denise Bolds discuss their experiences with being scammed by Augustine Colebrook, who promised a Belize retreat for November 2024 but changed it to February 2025, causing scheduling conflicts.

Despite paying in installments, they were unable to get refunds, with Colebrook citing financial difficulties and potential bankruptcy.

They highlight the broader issue of Colebrook's history of financial mishandling, including a $2,000 loss for a skills and drills conference cancellation and allegations of harming families in Oregon and Hawaii.

They urge caution for other birth workers and emphasize the importance of transparency and integrity in business practices.

Part 1 on YouTube: https://youtu.be/535CkMmvlgs?si=uCPE37UE6u1vyNv-

Part 2 on YouTube: https://youtu.be/MVdtv3IZxsg

Be Aware of Scammers!

Ravae Sinclair, a co-host of the Doula That podcast, shares her experience of being scammed by Augustine Colebrook, who promised a retreat for birth workers. Ravae paid $1,400 for a retreat scheduled for November 2024, but it was changed to February 2025, which was unacceptable. Despite multiple requests for a refund, Colebrook delayed and eventually took an additional $600 without authorization. Ravae emphasizes the importance of being informed consumers, using business credit cards for transactions, and the need for clear communication from service providers. She urges others to be cautious and to support her in recovering her money.

Ravae Sinclair @birthconnections @natlbirthpostpartumpros

Augustine Colebrook @artofbirthing @midwiferywisdom

Youtube:https://youtu.be/535CkMmvlgs?si=uCPE37UE6u1vyNv-

Outline

Scammers in the Birth Space

• Ravae Sinclair introduces herself and the topic of scammers in the birth space.
• She mentions that she and her co-host Denise have been impacted by scammers, with her matter still unresolved.
• Ravae emphasizes that it's important to speak out if one has been scammed to prevent others from falling victim.
• She encourages birth workers not to feel shame if they have been scammed, as it's not their fault.

The Scam Story Begins

• Ravae shares a story about planning to attend a retreat with her co-host Denise, inspired by a promotional ad.
• They made payments from January to June, expecting a retreat in November, but received no updates or communication.
• In July, they learned the conference in New Orleans had changed to virtual, raising suspicions about the retreat.
• The retreat dates were later changed to February 2025, which was unacceptable for Ravae due to her schedule and client commitments.

Attempts to Get a Refund

• Ravae and Denise reached out to Augustine Colebrook, the organizer, requesting a refund due to the significant date change.
• Augustine agreed to the refund but delayed it, initially saying it would be at the end of November.
• Denise's company was able to get provisional credit back on her credit card, but Ravae's payments were made through a business debit card, making it harder to challenge.
• Despite multiple emails and requests, Augustine did not provide the refund or communicate effectively.

The Scam Escalates

• In October, Ravae discovered an unauthorized $600 charge from Augustine, under a different business name.
• She had to cancel her debit card to prevent further unauthorized charges.
• Ravae expressed deep disappointment and frustration, especially seeing Augustine's social media posts about her activities in Bali while not returning the money.
• She emphasized the importance of being an informed consumer and the need for better communication and transparency from service providers.

Final Plea and Lessons Learned

• Ravae urged listeners to be cautious and informed when making purchases, especially in the birth space.
• She shared her frustration and the emotional toll of being scammed, especially by someone who claimed to be an ally.
• Ravae highlighted the importance of having a business credit card for transactions to have advocacy and protection.
• She called on listeners to support her in getting her money back and to be vigilant about who they do business with.

Personal updates, business growth, and nonprofit work.

• Ravae and Denise are back after a 3-month break, catching up with listeners.
• They discuss their busy schedules, podcast hiatus, and future plans.
• Denise Bolds shares updates on her personal and professional life, including travel and business growth.
• Ravae Sinclair expands agency, launches online training programs, and supports nonprofit while taking breaks and enjoying personal time.
• Post-pandemic changes in the birthing space, including increased inductions and doula burnout. 7:33
• Denise Bolds highlights post-pandemic changes in the birthing space, including increased inductions, doula burnout, and hospital closures.
• Ravae Sinclair seeks Denise's insights on the energy and vibe in the birth world since the pandemic, with a focus on shifting dynamics and professionals leaving their roles.
• Birth workers' experiences with social media and reproductive rights. 10:28
• Ravae Sinclair and Denise Bolds discuss the importance of Facebook groups for doulas, providing emotional and financial support.
• Doulas need community building and connection, which Facebook groups can offer, despite being isolated in their work.
• Ravae Sinclair observes growth in realization of the impact of reproductive rights loss on birth workers, with some feeling the pinch and others seeking business building skills.
• Ravae Sinclair sees some people pulling back from social media due to life's challenges, while others continue to vocalize their opinions and priorities.
• The state of the birth world, including burnout, lack of leadership, and traumatic birth experiences. 15:10
• Ravae and Denise discuss the importance of continued learning and mentorship in the birthing industry.
• Ravae Sinclair and Denise Bolds discuss the challenges of being a doula, including burnout and the need for responsible and experienced professionals.
• Many doulas are experiencing burnout, with some leaving the profession entirely, while others are struggling to keep up with the demands of their work.
• Birth professionals describe chaotic and traumatic situations in the wild west of childbirth.
• Optimism and solutions for improving the state of birth in the US, with a focus on nurses' roles and accountability. 21.49
• Ravae Sinclair emphasizes the importance of nurses in the birth process and calls for accountability.
• Sinclair and others aim to develop into educators and leaders in the field, offering advanced courses and solutions.
• Ravae Sinclair and Denise Bolds discuss the state of birth work, innovation, and optimism post-pandemic.
• They reflect on their experiences during the pandemic, including working in hazmat suits and neglecting personal well-being.
• Pivoting and innovation in doula work, with a focus on childbirth education and virtual training. 26:45
• Ravae Sinclair and Denise Bolds discuss innovative doula training programs, including NICU doula training and medical terminology for birth workers.
• Doulas can help families navigate traumatic gaps during childbirth and postpartum, including those in NICUs, with specific skills and support.
• Ravae Sinclair is focusing on supporting birth businesses and parents with convenient, accessible education.
• She is developing self-paced childbirth education modules and innovating her contracts for doulas and agencies.
• Ravae Sinclair and Denise Bolds discuss their return to sharing tips and ideas after taking a break.