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HR is supposed to care about people.
So why does so much of it feel like policy updates, tick-box training and vibes of “please sign to say you’ve read this”?
In this episode of Why Not and What If, Siobhán Godden and Andy Cracknell sit down with HR disruptor, stand-up comic and former chef-turned-wrestler Toby Kheng (Founder of Freeformers) to ask a very simple question:
If HR vanished tomorrow... would anyone actually notice?
Together they dive into a very spicy mix of:
- Why traditional HR and L&D are obsessed with knowledge retention instead of real behaviour change
- The brutal truth about sexual harassment training, policy updates and why none of it shifts culture on its own
- How behavioural economics and human-centred design can transform employee experience far more than another LMS login
- What wrestling and stand-up comedy can teach leaders about performance, feedback and genuine stakes
- Why so many HR teams are quietly de-skilling themselves by leaning on AI for everything
- The danger of L&D arrogance: “we’ll just build our own presentation skills course”
- How leaders destroy their own credibility with robotic comms and why humility, self-awareness and a bit of self-deprecation land so much better
Toby shares how learning stand-up and stepping into the wrestling ring gave him more powerful lessons than any corporate programme, and why he and his co-founder Emily are rebuilding the employer–employee relationship from the ground up through Freeformers.
Siobhán brings the HR realism (and the 2am wake-ups over clients’ people problems), while Andy owns his history of being “told off by HR” and why he still believes tone of voice, values and culture cannot be imposed from the top.
If you work in HR, L&D, people, internal comms or leadership and you suspect a lot of what you’re “supposed” to do is nonsense, this one might hit a nerve in the best possible way.
Connect with Toby & Freeformers
- Freeformers website: search “Freeformers employee experience” or visit freeformers.com
- Toby on LinkedIn: search “Toby Kheng Freeformers”
Got a topic you want us to dive into?
Email us at letstalk@whynotwhatif.com – your ideas genuinely fuel this chaos.
If this episode made you think, laugh or rage-text your HR WhatsApp group, hit follow/subscribe, leave a review, and share it with someone who still thinks “updating the policy” is a culture strategy.
Got a story or a view? Email letstalk@whynotwhatif.com
— we might do a follow-up episode with your takes.