Episodes

  • 279. Utopia Is A Myth

    279. Utopia Is A Myth
    Oct 13 2026
    How can you pursue excellence without becoming discouraged by imperfection?Organizational health does not mean eliminating conflict, dysfunction, or difficult seasons forever. In episode 279 of At The Table, Pat Lencioni and Cody Thompson explain why leaders need to replace the pursuit of organizational perfection with resilience, learning to expect downturns while continuing to move toward greater health. When things get messy, the answer is not despair, but returning to what is true, recommitting to core principles, and getting incrementally better.Topics explored in this episode:(00:00) The Myth of the Perfect OrganizationPat explains why organizational health should never be confused with creating a perfect company, team, or family.The pursuit of utopia can distort expectations and cause leaders to see normal struggles as evidence that something has gone fundamentally wrong.(02:56) When Healthy Organizations Get MessyPat and Cody discuss the danger of believing an organization will eventually eliminate politics, silos, conflict, and other problems forever.They argue that organizational health is better understood as resilience: the ability to work through inevitable problems instead of being defeated by them.(06:02) Progress Is Not a Straight LinePat acknowledges that even after 29 years of focusing on organizational health, The Table Group still experiences real problems and difficult periods.Cody describes organizational progress as a jagged line moving upward, where temporary downturns can look disastrous until leaders zoom out and see the larger trajectory.(09:31) The Danger of Expecting PerfectionCody explains how unrealistic expectations can turn temporary difficulties into damaging conclusions such as believing you are a bad leader or your company will fail.Pat argues that leaders should continue striving to improve while simultaneously accepting that perfection will never actually be reached.(12:42) Tomorrow Is a New DayPat and Cody encourage leaders and parents to return to what they know is true, recommit to their values, and begin again after difficult days.Growth never really ends, and progress comes from accepting imperfection while continuing to learn, change, and get incrementally better.This episode of At The Table with Patrick Lencioni is brought to you by The Table Group: www.tablegroup.com. We teach leaders how to make work more effective and less dysfunctional. We also help their employees be more fulfilled and less miserable.Subscribe for more content from Patrick Lencioni @PatrickLencioniOfficialStay Connected with Patrick LencioniLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/patrick-lencioni-orghealthInstagram: https://www.instagram.com/patricklencioniofficialTikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@patricklencioniofficialX: https://x.com/patricklencioniAt The Table with Patrick LencioniApple: https://tablegroup.me/appleSpotify: https://tablegroup.me/sptfyYouTube: https://tablegroup.me/youtubeBe sure to check out our other podcast, The Working Genius Podcast with Patrick Lencioni, on Apple Podcasts (https://workinggenius.me/apple), Spotify (https://workinggenius.me/sptfy), and YouTube (https://workinggenius.me/wgyt).Let us know your feedback via podcast@tablegroup.com.This episode was produced by Story On Media: https://www.storyon.co.
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    15 mins
  • 278. The Horse That Isn't Dead Yet (Are You Serious)

    278. The Horse That Isn't Dead Yet (Are You Serious)
    Sep 29 2026
    Are you treating teamwork as a real competitive advantage or simply something your company says it values?In episode 278 of At The Table, Patrick Lencioni and Cody Thompson revisit the debate over remote work, arguing that there is an important distinction between hiring genuinely remote employees, offering reasonable flexibility, and allowing local teammates to avoid working together. They challenge leaders to consider whether policies built primarily around convenience are undermining trust, culture, productivity, and the competitive advantages that come from real human interaction. Ultimately, the episode asks leaders and employees to answer a more fundamental question: are they serious enough about their work and their teammates to prioritize being together when they can?Topics explored in this episode: (00:00) The Horse Still Isn’t DeadPat argues that teamwork requires people to actually know one another and spend meaningful time together.Pat and Cody introduce the recurring remote-work debate and distinguish local work-from-home arrangements from truly remote employment.(03:16) When Work Becomes “Unserious”Cody explains why allowing nearby employees to avoid the office can feel inconsistent with a company that claims to prioritize excellence and teamwork.They imagine comparing colocated and remote teams not only on productivity, but also on loyalty, relationships, health, and culture.(06:07) Teamwork Requires InteractionPat compares workplace teams to sports teams, arguing that individuals cannot simply practice alone and expect the same team dynamics.They discuss practical flexibility while maintaining that regular interaction is essential when people have the ability to work together.(09:14) Convenience Versus Competitive AdvantagePat connects employees’ attitudes toward coming to work with the idea of hunger and commitment while cautioning leaders against enabling habits that weaken the team.Cody argues that trust, healthy conflict, culture, teamwork, and organizational health are all more difficult to develop when convenience consistently takes priority.(11:46) Are You Serious?Pat reframes the episode’s central question around whether people are genuinely serious about the work they are doing, comparing unnecessary remote work to taking an online class while already living on a college campus.Pat and Cody close by encouraging organizations to maintain flexibility and hire remotely when necessary while choosing to work together whenever circumstances make it possible.This episode of At The Table with Patrick Lencioni is brought to you by The Table Group: www.tablegroup.com. We teach leaders how to make work more effective and less dysfunctional. We also help their employees be more fulfilled and less miserable. Subscribe for more content from Patrick Lencioni @PatrickLencioniOfficialStay Connected with Patrick LencioniLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/patrick-lencioni-orghealthInstagram: https://www.instagram.com/patricklencioniofficialTikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@patricklencioniofficialX: https://x.com/patricklencioniAt The Table with Patrick LencioniApple: https://tablegroup.me/apple Spotify: https://tablegroup.me/sptfy YouTube: https://tablegroup.me/youtube Be sure to check out our other podcast, The Working Genius Podcast with Patrick Lencioni, on Apple Podcasts (https://workinggenius.me/apple), Spotify (https://workinggenius.me/sptfy), and YouTube (https://workinggenius.me/wgyt). Let us know your feedback via podcast@tablegroup.com. This episode was produced by Story On Media: https://www.storyon.co.
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    15 mins
  • 277. The Heart of Accountability

    277. The Heart of Accountability
    Sep 15 2026
    Are you avoiding a difficult conversation because you care about someone, or because you are protecting yourself?In episode 277 of At The Table, Pat Lencioni and Cody Thompson explore why accountability is consistently one of the hardest behaviors for teams and argue that avoiding difficult feedback is often selfishness disguised as compassion. They explain that real accountability comes from caring enough about another person to tell the truth, even when doing so risks discomfort, frustration, or temporary rejection. They also discuss the importance of trust, timing, leadership modeling, and practicing accountability until hard conversations become a normal part of a healthy team.Topics explored in this episode: (00:00) Why Accountability Is an Act of LovePat argues that avoiding difficult feedback is often selfishness disguised as compassion because it protects the person giving the feedback rather than helping the person who needs it.Pat and Cody introduce the idea that genuine accountability requires caring enough about someone to risk discomfort, rejection, or an unpleasant reaction.(04:39) Accountability Is More Than ConsequencesCody connects accountability to parenting and explains why loving someone sometimes requires doing something they may not appreciate in the moment.Pat and Cody distinguish real accountability from simply punishing poor performance, explaining why leaders should address problems before they reach the point of firing or other consequences.(09:43) Loving Someone Enough to Tell the TruthCody explains why accountability is ultimately about helping another person improve, both for the good of the team and for their own development.Pat discusses the personal cost of leadership, including the willingness to be temporarily disliked, and describes a progression for addressing problems directly before escalating them.(14:32) Trust, Timing, and Knowing When to SpeakPat and Cody explore the role of vulnerability-based trust in making difficult conversations possible and discuss circumstances when someone may genuinely not be ready to receive feedback.They explain why leaders should normally lean toward having the conversation while also recognizing that restraint and thoughtful timing can sometimes be the more loving choice.(19:12) Run Toward the RedPat encourages leaders to examine their intentions, accept the inherent messiness of accountability, and move toward uncomfortable issues instead of avoiding them.Cody explains how consistently modeling accountability can create a culture of peer-to-peer accountability, before Pat challenges listeners to identify a conversation they have been avoiding and consider having it.This episode of At The Table with Patrick Lencioni is brought to you by The Table Group: www.tablegroup.com. We teach leaders how to make work more effective and less dysfunctional. We also help their employees be more fulfilled and less miserable. Subscribe for more content from Patrick Lencioni @PatrickLencioniOfficialStay Connected with Patrick LencioniLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/patrick-lencioni-orghealthInstagram: https://www.instagram.com/patricklencioniofficialTikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@patricklencioniofficialX: https://x.com/patricklencioniAt The Table with Patrick LencioniApple: https://tablegroup.me/apple Spotify: https://tablegroup.me/sptfy YouTube: https://tablegroup.me/youtube Be sure to check out our other podcast, The Working Genius Podcast with Patrick Lencioni, on Apple Podcasts (https://workinggenius.me/apple), Spotify (https://workinggenius.me/sptfy), and YouTube (https://workinggenius.me/wgyt). Let us know your feedback via podcast@tablegroup.com. This episode was produced by Story On Media: https://www.storyon.co.
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    23 mins
  • 276. Your Team Needs More Workplace Drama

    276. Your Team Needs More Workplace Drama
    Sep 1 2026
    Are Your Meetings Too Comfortable?Workplace drama has a bad reputation, but in episode 276 of At The Table, Pat Lencioni and Cody Thompson argue that genuine drama is often exactly what healthy organizations need. When teams allow real emotions, disagreements, fears, and convictions into the room, they can address difficult issues instead of letting them quietly grow. The challenge for leaders is learning to distinguish healthy drama from manufactured melodrama and then creating an environment where people can say what really needs to be said.Topics explored in this episode: (00:00) Why Workplaces Need More DramaPat and Cody challenge the assumption that all workplace drama is unhealthy, distinguishing genuine human emotion from exaggerated melodrama.They argue that organizations become more interesting, engaging, and effective when people are willing to address the emotional reality behind important issues.(04:03) Putting Real Stakes Back Into WorkCody compares healthy organizations to compelling movies, explaining that meaningful stakes and interpersonal dynamics are what make both stories and workplaces engaging.Pat explains how companies often drain emotion from strategic conversations even though excitement, fear, disappointment, conflict, and hope are naturally part of important decisions.(08:47) Good Drama, Bad DramaPat and Cody explore how fear, disagreement, and other genuine emotions can help teams surface problems and address the elephant in the room.They distinguish legitimate workplace tension from manufactured or unnecessary emotion that may point to a personal struggle or dysfunctional behavior.(13:18) Leaders Have to Run Toward the DangerCody explains that the most valuable consulting moments occur when teams move beyond models and finally surface the real problem they have been avoiding.Pat and Cody argue that leaders should become energized by meaningful tension and run toward important issues instead of quickly neutralizing or taking them offline.(17:48) Mine for the Last Ten PercentPat shares a memorable prank involving a client team to illustrate how emotion and drama can make important organizational moments memorable and revealing.Pat and Cody encourage leaders to ask whether people are withholding the final 10% of what they think and to actively mine for genuine emotion and conflict.This episode of At The Table with Patrick Lencioni is brought to you by The Table Group: www.tablegroup.com. We teach leaders how to make work more effective and less dysfunctional. We also help their employees be more fulfilled and less miserable. Subscribe for more content from Patrick Lencioni @PatrickLencioniOfficialStay Connected with Patrick LencioniLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/patrick-lencioni-orghealthInstagram: https://www.instagram.com/patricklencioniofficialTikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@patricklencioniofficialX: https://x.com/patricklencioniAt The Table with Patrick LencioniApple: https://tablegroup.me/apple Spotify: https://tablegroup.me/sptfy YouTube: https://tablegroup.me/youtube Be sure to check out our other podcast, The Working Genius Podcast with Patrick Lencioni, on Apple Podcasts (https://workinggenius.me/apple), Spotify (https://workinggenius.me/sptfy), and YouTube (https://workinggenius.me/wgyt). Let us know your feedback via podcast@tablegroup.com. This episode was produced by Story On Media: https://www.storyon.co.
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    21 mins
  • 275. Where Do You Really Work?

    275. Where Do You Really Work?
    Aug 18 2026
    Where do you actually do your best and most important work?Work does not always happen where, when, or how people expect it to happen. In episode 275 of At The Table, Pat Lencioni and Cody Thompson explore why thinking, brainstorming, reflecting, and solving problems should count just as much as the visible activity people typically associate with productivity. They challenge leaders to create cultures that measure people by meaningful contribution and results rather than how busy they appear at their desks.Topics explored in this episode: (00:00) Where Does Work Really Happen?Pat questions whether traditional work hours and office spaces accurately reflect when people are actually doing their most valuable work.Cody expands the conversation by asking a more fundamental question: what should actually qualify as work?(03:43) Making Space for Different Kinds of WorkPat explains why choosing to stay away from the office for an hour of focused creative thinking can sometimes be more productive than immediately sitting at a desk.Pat and Cody discuss how personality, Working Genius, and the nature of a person's responsibilities can influence where and how that person works best.(07:27) What Leaders Should MeasurePat challenges CEOs to consider whether they want employees thinking about their work outside traditional work hours and argues that overly rigid boundaries can discourage that engagement.Cody pushes the idea further by questioning why computer work and task completion are so often treated as more legitimate than meetings, conversations, and creative thought.(10:57) The Four Types of WorkPat introduces a two-by-two framework that divides work into thinking versus doing and collective versus solitary.The conversation explores why each type of work may require a different setting and why organizations should deliberately create room for thinking rather than defaulting constantly to execution.(14:32) Effectiveness Over Visible ProductivityPat argues that healthy cultures can give people more freedom over how they work while still expecting meaningful results.Pat and Cody conclude that organizations should judge contribution by the work that actually needs to be accomplished rather than whether productivity is visibly demonstrated through desk time and constant activity.This episode of At The Table with Patrick Lencioni is brought to you by The Table Group: www.tablegroup.com. We teach leaders how to make work more effective and less dysfunctional. We also help their employees be more fulfilled and less miserable. Subscribe for more content from Patrick Lencioni @PatrickLencioniOfficialStay Connected with Patrick LencioniLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/patrick-lencioni-orghealthInstagram: https://www.instagram.com/patricklencioniofficialTikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@patricklencioniofficialX: https://x.com/patricklencioniAt The Table with Patrick LencioniApple: https://tablegroup.me/apple Spotify: https://tablegroup.me/sptfy YouTube: https://tablegroup.me/youtube Be sure to check out our other podcast, The Working Genius Podcast with Patrick Lencioni, on Apple Podcasts (https://workinggenius.me/apple), Spotify (https://workinggenius.me/sptfy), and YouTube (https://workinggenius.me/wgyt). Let us know your feedback via podcast@tablegroup.com. This episode was produced by Story On Media: https://www.storyon.co.
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    18 mins
  • 274. Let's Get Physical

    274. Let's Get Physical
    Aug 4 2026
    Why might physical work become more valuable as AI advances?Physical, hands-on work may be entering a new era of relevance as artificial intelligence changes the future of desk-based careers. In episode 274 of At The Table, Pat and Cody explore how tangible work can provide economic stability, human connection, visible accomplishment, and opportunities for personal development. They also challenge leaders and parents to consider whether efficiency should always take priority over the dignity, growth, and satisfaction that meaningful work can provide.Topics explored in this episode: (00:00) Why Physical Work Is Becoming Cool AgainPat introduces the growing appeal of physical, present, and tangible work as artificial intelligence begins replacing more computer-based tasks.Pat and Cody examine how previous generations encouraged young people to pursue white-collar careers rather than jobs involving physical skill or direct service.(03:40) The Unexpected Value of a Tree ServicePat shares the story of Rocky Hernandez, who built a successful tree-service business after coming to the United States without a formal education.Rocky’s son may discover that taking over and expanding the family business offers more opportunity and security than remaining in a high-tech career.(07:17) The Satisfaction of Visible ResultsCody explains how physical work changes people by requiring them to do difficult things and experience the concrete results of their effort.Pat broadens the definition of physical work to include teaching, childcare, restaurants, healthcare, customer service, and other careers built around human presence.(11:36) Work, Entrepreneurship, and Human DignityCody contrasts an automated lawnmower with a 13-year-old neighbor who started a lawn-care business to earn money for a ski pass.Pat and Cody discuss why decisions about automation are also moral decisions involving personal growth, opportunity, dignity, and the kind of people work helps create.(15:03) Learning Differently and Building Something RealPat considers how technology companies can preserve physical, customer-facing work while artificial intelligence reduces the need for certain technical roles.Pat and Cody predict changes in higher education and encourage families to recognize the practical wisdom of careers that produce tangible, visible results.This episode of At The Table with Patrick Lencioni is brought to you by The Table Group: www.tablegroup.com. We teach leaders how to make work more effective and less dysfunctional. We also help their employees be more fulfilled and less miserable. Subscribe for more content from Patrick Lencioni @PatrickLencioniOfficialStay Connected with Patrick LencioniLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/patrick-lencioni-orghealthInstagram: https://www.instagram.com/patricklencioniofficialTikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@patricklencioniofficialX: https://x.com/patricklencioniAt The Table with Patrick LencioniApple: https://tablegroup.me/apple Spotify: https://tablegroup.me/sptfy YouTube: https://tablegroup.me/youtube Be sure to check out our other podcast, The Working Genius Podcast with Patrick Lencioni, on Apple Podcasts (https://workinggenius.me/apple), Spotify (https://workinggenius.me/sptfy), and YouTube (https://workinggenius.me/wgyt). Let us know your feedback via podcast@tablegroup.com. This episode was produced by Story On Media: https://www.storyon.co.
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    19 mins
  • 273. First Impressions at Work

    273. First Impressions at Work
    Jul 21 2026
    Why can two people leave the same meeting with completely different understandings?A newcomer’s perspective reveals something experienced professionals often forget: work is far messier and less logical than it appears from the outside. In episode 273 of At The Table, Pat and Cody examine how fear, nonverbal communication, personality differences, and unspoken assumptions cause even healthy teams to misunderstand one another. They also explain how stronger meeting discipline, good intentions, and greater grace can help organizations navigate that messiness and move in the same direction.Topics explored in this episode:(00:00) A Newcomer’s View of WorkPat shares a surprising observation from his son Michael’s first summer working in an office environment.Michael notices that people can understand their jobs and speak the same language while still missing the deeper meaning behind one another’s words.(04:31) Why Alignment Is So DifficultPat and Cody discuss why even successful companies are filled with the complications and misunderstandings that come with being human.Organizational health can become a significant competitive advantage, but getting everyone to row in the same direction requires more than frameworks and good intentions.(09:15) Fear and the Things People Do Not SayElectronic communication makes misunderstandings more likely, but even face-to-face conversations leave important meaning unspoken.Employees may withhold concerns because they fear appearing negative, losing relational capital, or being viewed as poor team players.(13:49) Building Clarity Before the Meeting EndsTeams can improve alignment by reviewing what they discussed, what they decided, and what needs to be communicated outside the room.Even disciplined teams should assume that some percentage of the apparent clarity in a meeting may be incomplete or misunderstood.(18:14) Grace, Good Intentions, and Healthy OrganizationsPersonality differences can cause people to interpret the same words literally, generally, or metaphorically, creating frustration even among people who trust one another.Healthy organizations acknowledge the messiness of work while hiring humble, hungry, and smart people who can assume the best and work through misunderstandings.This episode of At The Table with Patrick Lencioni is brought to you by The Table Group: https://www.tablegroup.com. We teach leaders how to make work more effective and less dysfunctional. We also help their employees be more fulfilled and less miserable.Subscribe for more content from Patrick Lencioni @PatrickLencioniOfficialStay Connected with Patrick LencioniLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/patrick-lencioni-orghealthInstagram: https://www.instagram.com/patricklencioniofficialTikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@patricklencioniofficialX: https://x.com/patricklencioniAt The Table with Patrick LencioniApple: https://tablegroup.me/appleSpotify: https://tablegroup.me/sptfyYouTube: https://tablegroup.me/youtubeBe sure to check out our other podcast, The Working Genius Podcast with Patrick Lencioni, on Apple Podcasts (https://workinggenius.me/apple), Spotify (https://workinggenius.me/sptfy), and YouTube (https://workinggenius.me/wgyt).Let us know your feedback via podcast@tablegroup.com.This episode was produced by Story On Media: https://www.storyon.co.
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    22 mins
  • 272. The Profit Problem

    272. The Profit Problem
    Jul 7 2026

    What happens when your business starts treating profit as the goal instead of the indicator?

    In episode 272 of At The Table, Pat and Cody challenge one of the most common assumptions in business: that maximizing profit should be the goal. They argue that profit is essential, but when leaders treat it as a company's purpose, they risk harming customers, employees, products, and culture. Leaders are invited to decide what is enough, invest in what matters, and build organizations that create value beyond the bottom line.

    Topics explored in this episode:

    (00:00) The Assumption Behind Profit

    Pat introduces the problem with assuming that maximizing profit is the goal of business.

    Cody points out how natural that assumption feels, even for people who have never studied business formally.

    (03:00) Winning Without Running Up the Score

    Pat compares business to football, explaining that the goal is to win, not to score as many points as possible.

    Cody expands the analogy by explaining why eliminating competition can hurt innovation, customers, and the overall game.

    (07:27) Value Beyond the Spreadsheet

    Cody distinguishes between maximizing profit and creating value for customers, employees, and the broader organization.

    Pat explains why some business decisions, like giving away bread at a restaurant, may create long-term value even if they do not show up neatly on a spreadsheet.

    (10:29) The Damage of Extracting Too Much

    Pat describes how companies can burn goodwill with customers when they constantly squeeze them for more revenue.

    Cody and Pat discuss planned obsolescence, AI, and the danger of replacing human value with decisions driven only by financial gain.

    (15:48) Purpose, Ownership, and Enough

    Pat connects the conversation to The Advantage and the importance of knowing why a business exists.

    Pat and Cody explain how The Table Group has chosen longevity, peace, and a healthy work experience over chasing maximum growth and profit.

    This episode of At The Table with Patrick Lencioni is brought to you by The Table Group: www.tablegroup.com. We teach leaders how to make work more effective and less dysfunctional. We also help their employees be more fulfilled and less miserable.

    Subscribe for more content from Patrick Lencioni @PatrickLencioniOfficial

    Stay Connected with Patrick Lencioni

    LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/patrick-lencioni-orghealth

    Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/patricklencioniofficial

    TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@patricklencioniofficial

    X: https://x.com/patricklencioni

    At The Table with Patrick Lencioni

    Apple: https://tablegroup.me/apple

    Spotify: https://tablegroup.me/sptfy

    YouTube: https://tablegroup.me/youtube

    Be sure to check out our other podcast, The Working Genius Podcast with Patrick Lencioni, on Apple Podcasts (https://workinggenius.me/apple), Spotify (https://workinggenius.me/sptfy), and YouTube (https://workinggenius.me/wgyt).

    Let us know your feedback via podcast@tablegroup.com.

    This episode was produced by Story On Media: https://www.storyon.co.
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    21 mins