EPISODE OVERVIEW

What does it really take to do your best work as a leader? Cherie Mylordis has spent her career at the leading edge of that question — from the Sydney 2000 Olympic Games to boardrooms across the globe. Her research with 200 leaders revealed a confronting truth: only one in three felt they were doing their best work. And when she dug deeper, even those who said yes were constrained in almost exactly the same ways as everyone else.

In this conversation, Cherie shares the experiences that shaped her thinking — growing up as the first in her family to go to university, finding herself at the forefront of change management before anyone knew what to call it, and what the Olympics taught her about what people are truly capable of when purpose ignites them.

She introduces her Work in 3D framework — Dare, Ditch, Dial — and explains why the middle D is the one most organisations keep missing. And she makes a compelling case for why, in an age of AI and uncertainty, the most urgent work leaders can do is create the conditions for their people to thrive.

WHAT WE COVER

• Why Cherie became what she calls a "conscious curator" — and how that instinct has driven her entire career
• What it was really like to be employee number 52 at the Sydney 2000 Olympic Games — and the radical ways of working that made it the best Games ever
• The research finding that stopped her in her tracks: two thirds of leaders are not doing their best work — and why even those who say they are may be more constrained than they realise
• The Work in 3D framework: Dare (bold purpose), Ditch (let go of what no longer serves), and Dial (future-focused ways of leading and working)
• Why "ditch" is the D most organisations skip — and what gets left on the table as a result
• The concept of "conscious unbossing" and what Gen Z's rejection of traditional career ladders signals for the future of leadership
• The Siemens Energy innovation sprint: coaching a global team through the "messy middle" to produce some of the highest-scoring initiatives in the program
• A small coaching intervention that helped a talented woman engineer stop undermining herself — and end up delivering the final pitch
• Cherie's big audacious goal: making Work in 3D a global movement, not the exception

ABOUT CHERIE MYLORDIS

Cherie Mylordis is a leadership, innovation and future of work expert passionate about helping people do their best work and make a meaningful difference.

With decades of experience across diverse sectors, including leadership roles for the Sydney 2000 Olympic Games, Cherie has seen what’s possible when people are united by purpose and given the right conditions to thrive.

As the founder of nextgenify and nextgenify Academy, she works with leaders at all levels to challenge outdated ways of working and create environments where purpose, leadership and change come together for a better future.

Recognised as a LinkedIn Top Voice, Cherie’s work is featured in podcasts and publications including CEO Magazine, Dynamic Business and HR Leader, where she shares practical insights and fresh perspectives to help leaders navigate change and shape the future of work.

CONNECT WITH CHERIE MYLORDIS

• LinkedIn: Cherie Mylordis
• Website: nextgenify
• Academy: nextgenify academy

RESOURCES MENTIONED

• Work in 3D framework — Dare, Ditch, Dial. Cherie Mylordis / nextgenify
• Exponential Organisations — Salim Ismail (book referenced in relation to the Siemens Energy innovation sprint methodology)
• Conscious Unbossing — a term that emerged from UK research on how Gen Z relates to traditional management careers

WORK WITH CAROLYN

• Keynote speaking: carolynbutlermadden.com
• Purpose-led consulting: The Cause Effect

Seventy percent. That's the share of Australia's emissions associated with the infrastructure we build and operate — roads, railways, airports, tunnels. And the profession best placed to move that number? Civil engineering. Which also happens to be one of the most conservative industries on the planet.

Robin Power is the Chief Executive of Insitutek and the founding Chair of Ground Level Alliance — a volunteer-powered non-profit with a single ambition: to make sustainability a daily practice for the people who design and build our world.

He's not a civil engineer by training. He's a manufacturing engineer — which means he sees the industry through a people-and-process lens that most in the sector don't have. And it was that outsider's perspective, combined with a painful experience of losing everything in a failed property venture, that set him on the path to purpose.

In this conversation, Robin and Carolyn explore what it really means to use business as a force for good — and what it costs to choose to be a change agent in an industry that doesn't always want to change.

• Business as a relationship — and what it means to show up for clients when they're "up against the wall"
• The painful moment that reframed everything: losing a property business and what emerged from that period of deep reflection
• Why 70% of Australia's emissions connect back to civil engineering — and why the profession has more power than it realises
• The London Underground case study: how looking through a carbon lens changed what was possible
• Ground Level Alliance: building a movement of change with volunteer power and a vision of industry-wide transformation
• The first follower principle — why change agents need their people, not just their conviction
• Legacy thinking at 50: what it means to be in your "legacy phase" before you're anywhere near retirement
• B Corp certification in civil engineering — why most clients don't care, and why Robin does it anyway
• The Melbourne Business School partnership and what a sustainability course built into "flow of work" could unlock

Chief Executive, Insitutek, and Chair, Ground Level Alliance

Robin Power has spent his career pushing boundaries – and encouraging others to do the same. A strategist, educator, and advocate, he brings fresh thinking to civil construction challenges, combining practical experience, theoretical knowledge, and business acumen blended with his manufacturing engineer background.

For over 15 years, Robin has partnered with consultants, asset owners, government agencies, contractors, and researchers across Australia, New Zealand, and the Pacific to implement modern in situ testing and ground improvement methods that boost construction productivity, reduce costs, improve quality, minimise risk, and lower environmental impact.

Robin also champions sustainability as founding chair of Ground Level Alliance.

Click the 'Get Involved' tab to explore how to contribute — from sharing case studies to joining the community.

Robin Power on LinkedIn

• B Corp Movement
• Ground Level Alliance Sustainability in Civil Construction Course (in development, in partnership with Melbourne Business School)
• Derek Sivers: First Follower — Leadership Lessons from a Dancing Guy (YouTube)
• Intrepid Travel — intrepidtravel.com

For Love & Money is the podcast for leaders who believe that profit and purpose belong together. Each episode, host Carolyn Butler-Madden explores the intersection of business performance, human-centred leadership, and meaningful change — through stories of the people who are doing it.

Hosted by Carolyn Butler-Madden, founder of The Cause Effect.

Subscribe and leave a review wherever you listen to podcasts.

If this conversation sparked something for you, Carolyn works with leaders and organisations who want to put purpose at the centre of their business.

Keynote speaking — carolynbutlermadden.com

Purpose-led consulting — thecauseeffect.com.au

Episode Overview

What does a performing arts institution have to teach the business world? As it turns out — everything.

In this episode, Carolyn speaks with Terri Martin, Head of Corporate at NIDA — the National Institute of Dramatic Art — about why communication is the most underinvested leadership skill in organisations today, and what happens when leaders finally get it right.

Terri's journey to this work is anything but conventional. From a mortifying early experience presenting to a major client, to building and leading businesses across marketing, not-for-profit and education, she arrived at NIDA with a uniquely personal understanding of why so many leaders struggle to communicate with clarity and confidence — and what it costs them when they do.

Together, Carolyn and Terri explore why communication is far more than the words we choose, how performers' techniques can transform business leaders, and why the ability to inspire, influence and connect is absolutely vital for anyone who wants to lead a movement of change.

In This Episode

Terri and Carolyn cover a lot of ground, including the three components of communication — words, voice and body — and why most leaders only focus on one. They discuss what actors understand about presence that many leaders don't, why the pause is one of the most powerful tools a communicator has, and how communication misaligned with purpose creates distrust rather than followership. Terri also draws a sharp distinction between performing leadership and truly embodying it, and shares her vision for a future where communication skills are taught in schools.

About Terri Martin

Terri Martin is a commercial business leader passionate about helping individuals, teams and organisations communicate with clarity, confidence and impact. Terri leads NIDA Corporate Training, the National Institute of Dramatic Art's executive education business. The division works with leading organisations across Australia to develop communication, presentation and leadership capability using NIDA's world-renowned performer-training techniques. Each year, thousands of professionals participate in programs designed to strengthen presence, influence and authentic leadership in the workplace.

Before joining NIDA, Terri built and led consultancy businesses, marketing agencies and not-for-profit organisations, and began her career working in marketing and media including at Nickelodeon in London. This mix of commercial and creative experience underpins her strong belief in the power of communication to transform careers, teams and organisations.

Terri is an alumna of The Marketing Academy Leadership Program, a mentor for Future Women and previously served as Vice Chair and Non-Executive Director of ADHD Australia.

Connect with Terri:

On Linkedin

Nida corporate website

In this International Women’s Day 2026 special, Carolyn Butler-Madden speaks with negotiation expert Sam Trattles about women in leadership, pay equity, professional development budgets, and the power of self-advocacy. Together they explore how conviction, craft and courage help leaders confidently ask for what they want — without damaging relationships — and why valuing yourself is a leadership responsibility, not an indulgence.

What if balancing the scales doesn’t begin with policy — but with permission?

In this International Women’s Day special, I’m joined by Sam Trattles — strategic negotiator, Founder and CEO of Other Side, and author of I Love Negotiating and Negotiate Your Worth.

With experience across more than $575 million in negotiations, Sam has built a uniquely Australian methodology called The Power To Ask — helping leaders bridge the gap between knowing and asking.

But this conversation isn’t about becoming aggressive or combative.

It’s about the long shadow of the “good girl” conditioning. It’s about the hidden cost of not asking. And it’s about why valuing yourself is not indulgent — it’s leadership.

Together, we explore:

• Why so many women were raised to be “seen and not heard” — and how that still shapes behaviour at senior levels
• The financial, psychological and relational cost of not asking
• Why simply “doing a good job” rarely results in recognition or reward
• The myth that negotiation equals conflict
• The surprising hesitation of senior women to ask for professional development budget
• And how to structure a confident, strategic ask without blowing up the relationship

Sam unpacks her 3Cs framework:

Conviction — Do I truly believe what I’m asking for is fair and reasonable? Craft — Have I prepared properly and understood the other perspective? Courage — Am I willing to have the conversation, knowing the outcome may be yes, no or maybe?

As Sam reminds us:

“We know what we want to ask. We just don’t know how to do it so that we don’t blow up the relationship.”

And perhaps most powerfully:

“What’s the cost of not asking? That’s got to be greater than asking.”

This episode is an invitation — not just to ask for more — but to model what self-advocacy looks like in leadership.

Because if we want to balance the scales, perhaps it begins with valuing ourselves — not as an act of ego, but as an act of leadership.

Sam Trattles CEO-Founder | Strategic Negotiator | Author | Speaker

Fear stops people from asking for what they want. Sam Trattles is changing that. She helps leaders overcome the hurdle between knowing and asking.

With experience from over $575M in negotiations, Sam created a uniquely Australian methodology, The Power to Ask, taking insights from high-stakes negotiations into practical frameworks for everyday leadership challenges.

Author of bestselling books, I Love Negotiating and Negotiate Your Worth, Sam helps leaders find their voice in the moments that matter. It’s not about becoming an aggressive ‘gun-slinger instead, Sam teaches people how to negotiate their way, getting results whilst strengthening relationships.

As Founder and CEO of Other Side, Sam transforms powerless moments into acts of conviction, inviting you to confidently embrace the power to ask.

Learn more at: thepowertoask.com

Sam on Linkedin

The Power To Ask Website

Take the Assessment

If this conversation resonated with you, I’d be so grateful if you left a rating — and, if you have a moment, a short review on your favourite podcast platform.

It genuinely makes a difference. Ratings and reviews help more purpose-driven leaders discover these conversations — and grow a community of people who believe business can be a force for good.

And if you haven’t already, make sure you’re following or subscribing to the podcast so you don’t miss future episodes. There’s so much more to explore at the intersection of love and money.

What if the leadership talent businesses need most is hiding in plain sight? In this episode, I’m joined by Athena Manley, founder of The Flexible CEO, to explore a new leadership model connecting underutilised senior leaders with mid-sized organisations — and why reimagining leadership matters for people, performance and society.

EPISODE OVERVIEW

What happens when someone reaches the centre of corporate power — and decides the traditional leadership path no longer makes sense?

Athena is a strategist, advisor and entrepreneur whose career spans senior leadership roles across ASX-listed companies, Fortune 500 organisations and high-growth businesses. Just as she was being positioned for a CEO role, Athena paused to question the model itself — researching the personal, organisational and societal cost of how leadership is typically structured.

What she uncovered led her to create The Flexible CEO: a model designed to connect highly experienced, underutilised executives with mid-sized organisations that need senior capability but can’t always access it through traditional pathways.

At the heart of this work is a bridge — between boards of mid-sized organisations facing complex growth and transformation challenges, and what Athena calls “hidden superstars”: seasoned leaders whose talent is too often sidelined by outdated assumptions about age, career paths and leadership fit.

Athena shares the personal purpose driving this work — improving financial wellbeing and mental health — shaped by her own lived experience and what she witnessed growing up. We also explore the broader social impact of this model, including its potential to address ageism, unlock economic value and create healthier, more sustainable leadership outcomes.

In this conversation, Athena reflects on recent milestones — including speaking at Harvard and the United Nations, and the upcoming release of her book The Flexible CEO — and offers practical insights for leaders, boards and organisations curious about how this model could work for them.

This is a thoughtful, future-focused conversation about leadership — and what becomes possible when we design work around life, not sacrifice.

IN THIS EPISODE, WE EXPLORE:

• Why Athena chose to question the traditional CEO pathway — and what she found when she did
• The hidden cost of executive leadership on health, family and wellbeing
• How The Flexible CEO bridges the gap between organisations and “hidden superstar” leaders
• Age bias, the myth of being “overqualified,” and the talent we are wasting
• Portfolio careers, flexible leadership models and alternative CEO structures
• Why purpose isn’t powerful until it becomes personal
• What reimagining leadership could unlock for business, people and society

ABOUT ATHENA MANLEY

Athena Manley is a seasoned executive and owner of 3 companies. Across her 20+ year banking & insurance career, Athena has successfully led corporate strategy, distribution, IT, digital, people and culture, and business development in Fortune 500, ASX Top 10 and not-for-profit organisations.

Athena completed her MBA at UQ, being awarded the Excellence in Leadership Award, she is also a Harvard Alumnus and member of the AICD. Through her firm The Flexible CEO, Athena empowers businesses to navigate CEO transitions and CEO's and NEDs to transition to flexible portfolio careers. Her mission is to lead and inspire exceptional businesses that improve financial empowerment and mental health in society.

LINKS & RESOURCES

Athena on Linkedin

The Flexible CEO Website

Join the next ONLINE MASTERCLASS: Grow and succeed in a portfolio career- for CEOs, NEDs and Executives . Use code VIPCEO for free registration.

Episode Overview

What does it look like when a global brand doesn’t just talk about values — but organises around them?

In this episode of For Love & Money, I’m joined by Hilary McAllister, Activism Manager at Ben & Jerry’s Australia.

Hilary’s path into activism has been anything but linear. Beginning her career in events, she followed a growing concern for climate and environmental justice into grassroots campaigning, co-founding the not-for-profit For Wild Places before stepping into one of the most unusual roles in Australian business — leading activism from inside a global brand.

In our conversation, Hilary shares what drew her into purpose-led work, why serendipity and shared values matter more than rigid career plans, and how Ben & Jerry’s approaches climate justice as an always-on commitment rather than a one-off campaign.

We explore how activism operates inside the business, what it takes to earn the right to speak on social issues, and why progress is rarely linear — especially when you’re working for long-term systemic change.

Hilary also takes us behind the scenes of a major Australian climate campaign, unpacks Ben & Jerry’s mission-lock structure, and reflects on the balance between urgency, hope and personal sustainability when working at the frontlines of climate action.

At its heart, this episode is about purpose in action — and what becomes possible when business chooses courage over convenience.

In this episode, we explore

• Hilary’s non-linear journey into activism and purpose-led work
• Why love does have a role to play in business — depending on how you define success
• How Ben & Jerry’s embeds climate justice into its Australian strategy
• What “always-on activism” looks like inside a global brand
• Why progress in social and environmental change is rarely neat or predictable
• The importance of community, partnerships and earning the right to speak
• How individuals can connect everyday climate observations with meaningful action

About Hilary McAllister

Hilary is based in Gadigal, Sydney, and is the Activism Manager at Ben & Jerry’s Australia. In her role, Hilary leads the strategic development and execution of climate justice campaigns, supporting grassroots campaigners across the country. A dedicated environmentalist, Hilary is also the CEO and co-founder of For Wild Places, a not-for-profit dedicated to protecting wild places under threat. Hilary’s path to activism has been anything but ordinary - shaped by curiosity, conviction, and a deep desire to contribute to lasting, planet-saving change.

Links & Resources

Hilary McAllister on Linkedin

Ben & Jerry's Australia website

For Wild Places website

Hilary's personal website

Ben & Jerry's Double Dip book - how to run a values-led business and make money too

Connect with Carolyn/Learn more about her work

Speaking website

Consulting, Leadership Development & Coaching

Linkedin