In this week’s episode of The Breakout Growth Podcast, Sean Ellis and Ethan Garr chat with positioning expert, April Dunford, author of the best-selling books, “Obviously Awesome” and “Sales Pitch.”

April had a successful career as a marketing and operations executive at companies including IBM and Nortel and it was in these roles that she developed her passion and approach to building effective positioning. Today she shares this passion and her knowledge as a consultant, speaker, and writer with companies around the world. 

In “Sales Pitch”, April lays out her hypothesis that marketers have been taught storytelling that doesn’t work for sales. She says 60% of deals that are started are never finished so it’s often indecisiveness and the status quo that sales teams must work to overcome. Even if you are not focused on sales, you will find a lot of value in this discussion.

Messaging and positioning are fundamental to growth and what we get to in this conversation is a deeper look into how businesses can differentiate themselves, help their audiences discover value, and ultimately break through the noise.

What makes this especially fun and useful is that April isn’t afraid to take contrary and non-obvious positions. As an example, she doesn’t like the concept of Product/Market Fit, and since we do, it made for some good back-and-forth!

So jump into this week’s episode of The Breakout Growth Podcast as we learn more about the art of effective positioning with April Dunford.

And thanks for listening to the Breakout Growth Podcast. Don’t forget, to watch us and subscribe on Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-K_CY4-IrZ_auEIs0j97zA/featured

We discussed:

* April's story from executive to “Positioning is my jam!”(06:46)

* The problem with most sales pitches (09:44)

* Why it matters that 60% of started deals are never finished (22:04)

* Building and validating your sales Pitch (27:02)

* Positioning isn’t static; how to keep it fresh (52:44)

And much, much, more . . . 

If you want to know just how awesome AllTrails is, just ask Apple! Out of over 2 million apps in the App Store, AllTrails is one of just three finalists waiting to hear if they have been selected as Apple’s 2023 App of the Year. So, of course, we are delighted to welcome back to the podcast, Ron Schneidermann, AllTrails’s CEO. 

Ron first joined Sean Ellis and Ethan Garr for a chat back in early 2022. At the time, the company was riding Covid-driven enthusiasm for socially distanced activities and had recently raised $150 million in private equity funding. Now, almost two years later, we wanted to hear how it has been going for this hyper-growth app that helps people have fun exploring the outdoors.

After the pandemic, Ron and his team were determined to continue accelerating growth and that meant pushing in new directions while at the same time building on what was already working well. To keep moving forward, they made big bets on international expansion, invested in new areas like e-commerce, and kept the focus on improving mindset and execution. And the growth has continued. 

“Momentum begets momentum,” says Ron, and while the flywheel has accelerated and many of the bets have worked out, it hasn’t all been easy. In this conversation, Ron shares not just the wins, but the struggles and challenges that come hand-in-hand with managing rocketship growth. 

There is a lot to this episode. From valuable learnings when looking to expand across borders to a really important discussion on leadership and vulnerability. And you will find out what it means when Ron says at AllTrails “Authenticity is our currency.”AllTrails. 

So jump into this week’s episode of The Breakout Growth Podcast. And thanks for listening to the Breakout Growth Podcast. Don’t forget, to watch us and subscribe on Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-K_CY4-IrZ_auEIs0j97zA/featured

We discussed:

* Obsessing on growth, not just maintaining the status quo (08:43)

* “Much harder than we expected;” pushing for international growth (14:40)

* Modern growth structure. Is “head of growth” obsolete? (35:43)

* Growth as a role of influence, not ownership (36:36)

* People challenges and hypergrowth; avoiding toxcity (44:55)

* Authenticity as a personal core value (52:16)

And much, much, more . . .

According to Todd Olson, Pendo’s founder and CEO, ‘the market isn’t just receptive to AI, it’s demanding it!’  So in this week’s episode of The Breakout Growth Podcast Sean Ellis and Ethan Garr dive deep with Todd, to better understand what this and other changes in the world of product, marketing, and growth will mean for businesses.

Pendo helps companies accelerate how they build and launch products that customers actually want by combining the power of analytics tools with messaging and customer experience features. For Product-Led Growth companies, this can be quite powerful as it helps teams intelligently use analytics to understand and drive specific valuable behaviors. 

In this spirited and fun conversation, we get a sense of Todd’s approach and philosophy, and how that has helped drive Pendo’s international growth over the past 10 years.  From the outset, the company was focused on improving customer experiences in software, but in the past few years, they have been able to accelerate that mission by investing in machine learning.

Todd says it’s really important to understand that the “mindset drives the tech,” not the other way around, and he’s built a culture to support that. Just as with our last podcast episode with the VP of EMEA from Moloco, Todd is laser-focused on building enthusiasm around outcomes from technology, not on the technology itself.

He says teams have a tendency to celebrate when they ship software, but really the celebration should start when the desired outcome is achieved. It’s this kind of candid and thoughtful growt-minded thinking that made for a great discussion and undoubtedly has been foundational to Pendo’s success thus far.

So jump in! And thanks for listening to the Breakout Growth Podcast. Don’t forget, to watch us and subscribe on Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-K_CY4-IrZ_auEIs0j97zA/featured

We discussed:

* Building Pendo with a mission to improve experiences in software (06:10)

* Speed of innovation is important, but we have to balance change (13:22)

* What AI means for businesses and how to embrace it (18:14)

* Marketing and product’s relationship to data has changed at a different pace (22:00)

* In the future, every PM is thinking about growth (37:31)

* Smarter and more efficient: the impact of a down economy (47:58)

And much, much, more . . .